Keith Olbermann Talks to Erich "Mancow" Muller About His Waterboarding Experience
Keith talks to WLS-AM 890's Erich "Mancow" Muller about his experience being waterboarded.
Muller: You said something incorrectly and I think everyone has. They compare it to drowning. Now I drowned as a kid and I had to be revived and I've also been white water rafting, if you've ever had that sensation of being caught under water. This is worse. Okay, this isn't gulping for air. This is...your brain is shut off. This is water at the back of your skull, a gallon of water poured down my nose, I had a Marine do it, and I mean it was goodnight Irene, game over.
[.....]
Look, I've seen the video. You've shown the video. The sprinkling of the water. Big deal. They said what was your psychological state. I was laughing at it. I was willing to prove and ready to prove that this was a joke and I was wrong. It was horrific. It was instantaneous and look I felt the effects for two days. I had chest pains. I told my wife, look I have two little kids-- we prayed. I said dear god help me. I had chest pains I was so stressed out by this.
And "Mancow" only got the Fisher-Price version of waterboarding. If he had to go through what the Gitmo prisoners were subjected to I can only imagine what his response would have been. It was actually very nice to see the two people with very different political ideologies manage to come together and have a civil discussion about this issue and care more about what they agreed on than fighting with each other.
It's fun that the only ones to have the courage to find out what they're talking about are Christopher Hitchens and a guy by the name of Mancow.
Mancow.
Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck and all the other conservative blowhards must be so proud that they've been out-couraged by an atheist and a man/cow hybrid.
Hopefully humanity will one day learn to be humane.
Atheists and man/cow hybrids!
war apologist Hitchens out of it. Oh, he is the atheist?
Screw him anyway.
"Folks, this is not your father's Republican Party."
Joe Biden
He talked about praying after his extreme baptism, but perhaps he was praying to his Dark Lord, Satan. I was obliged to listen to him in my Dad's car today, and after having a accused serial wifekiller do standup from jail, he mentioned that it is torture, but he doesn't care if we use it as a country.
I thought that idiot Hannity publicly agreed to being subjected to waterboarding. Did it happen yet?
That coward STILL refuses to accept that it's torture even after Mancow told him it was.
And I tell ya what, I have mad respect for Mancow, for getting waterboarded in the first place, and then manning up to the fact that it IS torture.
He should be commended for what he did.
teh juevos to show up on Countdown.
I can't remember any other conservative talk show host doin that.
That took guts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTN9RvXi4mI
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
FYI: it's huevos, not "juevos".
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
why he needed eggs to show up on Countdown. Surely, given his name, Olbermann would have asked for cheese or cream instead of a poultry product.
"Folks, this is not your father's Republican Party."
Joe Biden
point. Chickens are not the first farm animal that comes to mind when we think of Mancow.
"The greatest tyranny is censoring information in order to be better able to control people." - Cristina Saralegui
Huevos is Spanish slang for "balls". Which is itself a slang term. You are familiar with slang, right?
Because you know, those are not balls between your legs either, they're testicles.
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
The two are not compatible in attitude, by the way. To say someone is "ballsy", or has "big balls", means they're brave, rash, reckless, etc.
But to say someone is a huevon, i.e., he has large "eggs", is almost exactly the opposite: it means he's a ninny, a spineless idiot. It's the kind of thing you say while rolling your eyes at someone's really awful jokes.
Interesting, no?
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
That the people who have actually been waterboarded say it is torture?
But the cowards that have not say it is not. Why?
Because they are first and foremost COWARDS and paid LIARS!
the old Chicken Hawk syndrome doing its thing?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKss2pBYQ6Y&fe...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
How do you milk a mancow?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
LOL
That's between him and his wife. ^_^
D
How a maid can milk a bull
Every stroke a bucketful
- Old English folk song
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
Is that what Olbermann's describing with his right hand?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
I had to look twice to make sure that thumb wasn't his middle finger.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhSYbRiYwTY
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Well how else are you gonna
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kL94euIVzXs
When you're dyslexic?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Now... well... how old are you again? ;-)
Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, etc. Mancow kisses all of their asses...to this goof, they've done nothing wrong. And it's not torture if the guy administering the waterboarding stops when you ask.
"worse than drowning"
Thanks Mr Muller.
Sorry you had to experience it to realize it isn't "simulated drowning" or a "splash of water in the face."
Anyone who, lying in a bathtub full of water, has rested their feet on the rim at the head of the tub and let their head and arms slip below the water knows the terror, the panic, the trauma of the next few seconds.
In the REAL waterboarding (reported by those who "we" have tortured) they let your lungs fill with water, then it takes two guys to revive you. One holds you up while the other punches you hard in the diaphragm to force the water from your lungs. Then they strap you down and do it again.
And bear in mind, these aren't US military or actual CIA staff conducting these torture sessions. These are "contractors" .. many of whom were Latin American police and military trained at "our" School of the Americas, then hired by CIA contractors like Titan and CACI to go to Iraq and do "our" dirty work.
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
when I was 8 or 9 and I'll never forget how scared I was. The buoyancy of my ski jacket is what saved me. I remember hitting the river bottom and bouncing against the underside of the ice a few times until I was able to climb out (I was all alone). How I ever got out of there is one of those mysteries of life. I never told anyone (especially my family) about it, but I will never, ever forget the terror I felt.
I can't imagine how awful it must be to feel like you are drowning while being strapped down, punched and gawd-knows-what-else at the same time. The fear and helplessness must be absolutely horrifying.
your display of empathy disqualifies you from the Supreme
Court of the United States.
"Folks, this is not your father's Republican Party."
Joe Biden
Olbermann and the "Mancow" joker discussed his waterboarding deal. In no uncertain terms Mancow says it was torture. They talked and talked how bad it was and how it should not be done etc etc but not once did they mention the fact that when the Cheney crew were torturing these guys they had their hands tired down and their ankles tied down and they could not just turn it off like the Mancow was able to do. And don't forget that one of the guys was tortured 183 times in on month and one of the other guys was tortured over 50 times and who knows hoe many times the other guy was tortured. They were tied down and could not call it quits whenever they wanted to.
Don't you realize that it's precisely because of our limp-wristed librul application of "enhanced torture" that we had to do it so many times? It's because they kept dropping their "safety cow" so quickly that we kept having to reset the board, get a dry cloth, and start over.
..Mancow get it, that he was able to sit up, that he was waterboarded-lite as it were. Unfortunately, too many people in this country think torture is OK compared to what the "enemy" does to our captured soldiers and, they have to have revenge on "the Muslims" for 9/11.
No question, I wanted to see al-Qaeda crushed and defeated and OBL..well, let's not go there right now. W and his crime family screwed up big time when they went to war OR they didn't screw up and prosecuted the war exactly the way their corporate masters wanted them to. Either way, torture is illegal and should've never entered into the equation. It weakened us, yielded no valuable information and was a great recruiting tool for OBL. But try and explain that to some of the people in this country; they'll think your nuts. (Happens regularly to me.)
Mickey: "It was an epiphany. Do you know what an epipany is?"
Keoni: "NOT NOW MICKEY!"
I admit I don't like Mancow but I do applaud him for at least standing up for what he believed in and then admitting he was wrong. Too many on both sides won't do that.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnvbtAoucPU
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
The real stupid part that is see in all of this is that we are having this conversation at all. As if there is a question if waterboarding is torture. THERE IS NO QUESTION! I hate it that the subject was ever changed and the time and effort waisted on IF it is torture. The earth is not flat, the earth is not the center of the universe, bears do deficate in the woods and WATERBOARDING IS TORTURE!
..a sound when they fall in the woods.
You're absolutely right; why are we having this discussion?
Oh yeah, some phony-baloney memos said it was OK because it was already done and they had to cover their asses and come up with excuses to invade Iraq. So how does that make it legal?
Hmmm, can the Hague Court issue warrants for the arrest of a former president?
Mickey: "It was an epiphany. Do you know what an epipany is?"
Keoni: "NOT NOW MICKEY!"
(to complete your thought)....Torture is a War Crime!!! All of those involved should be investigated and prosecuted.....soon!
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
making the story even more damning for the pro-torture crowd is that this stunt by the mancow was hardly 'waterboarding', it was the disney version of torture.
that said, the debate over the fact that waterboarding is torture is yesterday's fight, the right has conceded. start preppin' for the new fight being argued by the knuckledraggers: torture is necessary.
First lets acknowledge the dichotomy of arguing its not torture, yet its effective in eliciting information against people's will.
Ok, the reason why its torture is because its NOT 'simulated drowning'. I hate that phrase. Makes it sound like someone is wearing a helmet and video of water is played inside. It is REAL drowning. Its just that its controlled. The people controlling the situation are drowning you, and this is what makes it torture: Only the people controlling the situation can stop the drowning. Thats what makes it torture. Its not how it 'feels' tho that is a part of it. From the victim's point of view they are being drowned, perhaps to death for all they know, until they cooperate. That is torture.
If I told you I was living in a $10,000-a-month apartment, you might be impressed. If I told you I stole the money to pay the rent every month, you'd be less impressed.
What today's Republicans basically say is "We're too incompetent to catch the bad guys within the rules, so we want the right to break the rules to make it easier for us." If you can't catch Al Qaeda without torturing people, then you suck at catching Al Qaeda. Go do something else and let the adults work at it.
...regarding torture to maintain his ratings. Mancow knew going into this farce that he was going to change his stance. This phony was a floundering, aging DJ here in Chicago who saw an opportunity and jumped on the pro-America, kill those Muslims, Bush loving, career revitalizing bandwagon after 9/11. He does a shitty, right wing version of Howard Stern's act. His radio show parasites off of Rush and Hannity here so he repeats the same bullshit to keep that type of listener happy.
should be muted? As in, if we only had a few posts of some of his previous work, we might not be awarding him a broadcast medal of honor?
"Folks, this is not your father's Republican Party."
Joe Biden
I like the part where he took off his glasses and made his serious face... like he was about to get physical.
Khalid Sheik Mohammed said he was just starting to get used to it by the 150th time or so. Like water off a ducks back.
Its obvious the Bushtards were just trying to get a false confession from anyone so they could try and sell it to cover their asses for the NeoZionist scum illegal invasion of Iraq.
Khalid Sheik Mohammed said he was just starting to get used to it by the 150th time or so. Like water off a ducks back.
Its obvious the Bushtards were just trying to get a false confession from anyone so they could try and sell it to cover their asses for the NeoZionist scum illegal invasion of Iraq.
Sorry, got message to say first attempt to post failed...
Well maybe if they didn't do this so much:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zw94DdEeOXs
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
and it is illegal, period.
i don't care if they were tickling the prisioners with a feather to make them "sing."
WTF, in the XXI century America is still debating the merits or lack thereof torture? It is not about the level of pain, that is nothing but a red herring, it is torture... it is illegal. Period, end of discussion. This whole "gradation" nonsense it is just an attempt by the right to subvert the discussion.
They can wax poetic about their experiences, or lack there of, with torture. I don't give a f*ck what your opinion is, how much you did or didn't like it, if it hurt or not, I DON"T CARE. It is torture, it is illegal, end of discussion.
I take the Geneva Convention over some asshole's personal opinion any day. We can't and we shouldn't base our policy upon subjective and qualitative opinions purely based on anecdotal experience. This is a country of laws not men.
You don't like it? You are free to leave... I heard that Somalia is lovely this time of the year. Right wing paradise... they should move there. Buh bye don't let the door hit ya.
I saw Mancow for the first time today, and he's the only wingnut male I find easy on the eyes. I suppose if I had to listen to him on the radio I'd find him hard on the ears, but hey good on him for submitting to waterboarding and admitting the truth about it.
"The greatest tyranny is censoring information in order to be better able to control people." - Cristina Saralegui
It sounded like, as they started the interview, that Mancow was going to be an asshole. Olberman pulled him back in to a rational back-and-forth. Well played, Olberman.
Olbermann NEVER has right-wing guests on his show.....WAHHHH.
Another lie debunked.
Nice that he admits he's wrong, but don't call me until he admits the whole current Rethug belief system is destructive and wrong. Otherwise, he's just another kinda cute right-wing closet case.
*
"The greatest tyranny is censoring information in order to be better able to control people." - Cristina Saralegui
I notice they left out the cloth over his face, which would have trapped the water stream going in and made it IMPOSSIBLE to catch even the slightest bit of air, as well as being far more damaging psychologically (i.e., feeling of being trapped, helpless).
Well, at least one derisive asshole has had his fathead opinions handed to him.
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
Why the outrage over this torture? Did anyone honestly think that a government that has sponsored terrorism, killed leaders, and overthrew governments worldwide over decades, did not torture until Bush/Cheney came along?
Yes, but always before, it was (supposed to be) an aberration. Under the Cheney administration, "enhanced torture" became US policy.
the rabid and ridiculous right, I do give him kudos for doing what Insannity is too much of a coward to do - even though he said he'd do it for charity, for the 'military and their families.' LMAO!
I liken Mancow to a child - you tell them, repeatedly, not to put their hand on the hot stove, but, kids being kids, think that if Mom says it's bad, it MUST be good. So, instead of listening to the expert (Mom), who has the experience to make such a bold statement, the kid stupidly puts his hand on the hot stove. Lo and behold, while his hand swells with blisters, and experiences blinding pain, he cries to the experienced expert (Mom), that she really WAS right.
Well, I think this analogy pretty much describes the rest of the torture cheerleaders on the rabid and ridiculous right. They'd much rather learn the hard way, as opposed to listening to those with the experience to know better.
"I liken Mancow to a child - you tell them, repeatedly, not to put their hand on the hot stove, but, kids being kids, think that if Mom says it's bad, it MUST be good."
You're kinda right, but it may actually be a quite healthy thing to be equipped with the desire to know - really know - things directly through your own experience and through your senses. Even if it's for all the wrong reasons (Mancow, I believe, really wanted to laught it off and ridicule those calling it torture.)
In the absence of that particular sort of self-experienced knowledge, people seem honestly unable to conceive of water boarding as torture because they have not experienced it on their own bodies. Intellectually they probably have a pretty good idea that it's not entirely a pleasure to be water boarded, but they have NO feelings for it and don't have the empathic circuitry to imagine how it's like for real.
A good thing we have people out there who wants to know and share those direct experiences with us. As I usually ask: would you want to take advice on sex from a virgin?
I think a good test of whether waterboarding is torture would be to waterboard its most prominent defenders 81 times. They can, however, end it at anytime by declaring waterboard torture. If they do, it will prove one of two things:
1) If waterboarding is actually effective at obtaining information, then we will know it really is torture, or;
2) If its not torture and they just said it to end it, well then its not really an effective method to extract information.
In either case, its use should be discontinued. On the other hand, if they successfully complete all 81 sessions, well then I guess we'd know its not torture and we'd owe them an apology - no harm, no foul, its not like they were tortured.
And just to sweeten the deal for any republican objectors, if the waterboardees complete all 81 sessions then they're reward will be tax breaks for all! (and by all, I mean to wealthiest 2%)
Mancow is just another really hatefilled conservative that I thought didn't have a brain in his head, but then he agreed waterboarding is absolute torture.
for Mancow than that loudmouth coward Hannity.
NOBODY 2012
I use to take Olberman at face value but that's when i went dumb for a minute. and then i realized he's just another corporate schmuck. Who's too busy pandering to the left to realize true journalism comes when you tell the truth at at all cost. Wait there haven't been true journalism in such a longtime who are we kidding, The journalist nowadays if you care to call them that are borderline retarded. I wonder if he has lunch with O'reiley and Hannity and Limbaugh on how they can attack each other for ratings sake!!!
Stop Watching T.V waiting on these "journalist" to tell you the truth pick up a book and feed your brain!!
Which truth is Olberman not telling?
http://nhnecommunity.ning.com/video/former-in...
... Hannity promised to undergo water boarding for charity, but hasn't.
Brave Hannity ran away.
Bravely ran away, away!
When danger reared its ugly head,
He bravely turned his tail and fled.
Yes, brave Hannity turned about
And gallantly he chickened out.
Bravely taking to his feet
He beat a very brave retreat,
Bravest of the brave, Hannity!
He is packing it in and packing it up
And sneaking away and buggering up
And chickening out and pissing off home,
Yes, bravely he is throwing in the sponge...
-- Apologies to Python(Monty)
See (edited) version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZwuTo7zKM8&fe...
These right wing liars need to be called on their cowardice and their saying anything to try to "prove" a point.
E Pleb Neesta --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3b56e0u0EgQ
GODISNOWHERE
Blessed are the cheese makers. --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paJUj8HJ4D8
Comments are closed on this entry