President Obama: I'm Getting 95% of What I Want on Reform in Health Care Bill
By Heather Friday Dec 25, 2009 4:30pm
As Steve Benen noted this is a better answer than the "I didn't campaign on the public option" nonsense which I thought was silly and insulting. People who've been following the process understand the difference between what you'd like to get passed and what's achievable with this Congress. President Obama said he got 95% of the reform he wanted in the health care bill. Whether you can call this 'reform' or not and whether he actually got what he wanted as opposed to what he campaigned on is something all of us will be debating for some time to come. There are some good things in the bill but I personally don't think they outweigh the bad without some meaningful regulation on the insurance companies.
This type of clarity in the beginning of the debate might have been helpful since we could have been pushing harder for meaningful regulations to keep prices down instead of a public option, but who knows. Maybe the public option was nothing but a shiny object so Joe Lieberman could have his ego stroked and feel like he got his evens with the progressive blogosphere and keep him focused on that instead of him attacking things the administration did actually care about keeping in the bill. Lieberman gets to give the progressive community a kick in the teeth to make him feel better without hurting what they actually cared about having passed in the legislation. It's that or Lieberman gladly played boogie-man to give them exactly what they wanted, or maybe a little of both.
I don’t know of anyone who is satisfied with what’s in this bill so far and no one knows what we’re going to end up with once it comes out of the conference committee. I do know we’re going to keep fighting to fix whatever mess gets heaped upon us and that John is talking to House members to keep the pressure on to try to improve whatever comes out of the committee. Next moves will come after the holidays.
You can watch the entire interview on PBS's site here.
On a personal note, I hope everyone who is celebrating had a wonderful holiday out there. We did ours a bit early because of conflicts with my brothers seeing their families and people going out of town. Everyone dealing with this terrible weather be safe out there and drive carefully.
Transcript below the fold.
JIM LEHRER: So you are completely satisfied with the health-reform bill that the Senate's about to pass?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: You know, I am never completely satisfied. But I am very satisfied. Look, when I made that speech in the joint session of Congress, I set out some criteria for what in my mind would qualify as reform, based on the conversations that I had with families all across the country and the letters that I was receiving about people really going through a tough time in the health-care system.
I said that we wanted to make sure that people who didn't have health insurance could get health insurance. And this bill covers 30 million people who don't have it.
I said that for people who have health insurance, we've got to end insurance-company abuses, where they ban you from getting health insurance because of preexisting conditions, or they've got fine print - print that sets up lifetime limits on what you can spend, so if you really get sick, suddenly you may lose your house, even though you think you've got health insurance.
We've got the strongest health-insurance reforms that we've ever seen in this bill. I mean, all that - that whole argument about patients' bill of rights back in the 1990s: this is the patients' bill of rights on steroids.
I said it had to be deficit-neutral. It doesn't just meet that criteria; it actually reduces the deficit. I said that we had to make sure that we were bending the cost curve, meaning that we were starting to get a better bang for our buck so that doctors, hospitals, nurses, providers all were focused on what provides quality care, and not just more expensive care. And we have all of those game-changers inside the bill.
So when you look at the criteria that I've set forth, this is a good deal. Now, are there provisions here, provisions there, that I would love to have in the bill? Of course. But overall, I think that I've seen 95 percent of what will work for the American people, for small businesses and for the government budget that I was seeking from the beginning.
JIM LEHRER: Ninety-five percent of what you wanted?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Absolutely.
JIM LEHRER: Now, do you feel the same way about the House version that passed a few weeks ago?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: You know, what's interesting is, the House version and the Senate version are almost identical. There are some differences in terms of how they pay for particular provisions. But the same principles about setting up an exchange where small businesses and individuals can buy in, pool their purchasing power to get a better deal from insurance companies, that's in both bills. The insurance reforms are both in the House and the Senate versions.
One of the things that I think is important to remember is that, even though the exchange - the pooling that I'm talking about doesn't start for several years, a lot of the insurance reforms start right away. Children, for example, won't be able to be barred from getting health insurance, even if they have a preexisting condition, as soon as I sign that bill and we get that reform in place.
So there are a lot of provisions that are both in the Senate and the House bill. I actually think that reconciling them is not going to be as difficult as some people may anticipate.
JIM LEHRER: Are you going to be involved in the reconciliation?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Absolutely.
JIM LEHRER: I mean, on a hands-on way?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Absolutely.
JIM LEHRER: Are you going to actually participate with -
PRESIDENT OBAMA: We are - we are - we hope to have a whole bunch of folks over here in the West Wing, and I'll be rolling up my sleeves and spending some time before the full Congress even gets into session, because the American people need it now. I mean, something that's gotten lost, Jim, during the course of this debate - because this is how Washington works - it ends up being, well, did the president win on that one or did he lose on that one? What's Joe Lieberman doing today, and what's Mitch McConnell doing tomorrow?
Right now there are families who don't have health insurance and, as a consequence of somebody getting sick in their family, have been bankrupt. Right now there are small businesses who've been doing the right thing by their employees and just got a notice from their insurance companies that their premiums went up 25, 30, 40 percent; and that business owner's having to make a decision, do I start dropping coverage for my employees or do I have to lay off one employee to keep coverage for everybody else?
Those kinds of decisions are happening right now. And so, you know, I intend to work as hard as I have to work, especially after coming this far over the course of the year, to make sure that we finally close the deal.
JIM LEHRER: But you're not - you're not going to sit down at that table with the conferees with a list, spoken or unspoken, of your own kinds of killer provisions that you can't - you got to get them out of there, or a favorite provision that you want in there? I mean -
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Look. Look, I mean, the -
JIM LEHRER: - any of your own preferences?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Obviously, I've got some very smart people who are here working day to day on these issues. I am, though, consulting very closely with health-care economists, for example, to make sure that - for example, the provisions that will change how doctors, hospitals, other providers provide care so that it's more patient-centered and it's not focused on how many tests can we do, but rather what's going to produce the best-quality outcomes; how can we reduce, for example, medical errors in hospitals, which cost us hundreds of billions of dollars and thousands of lives every single year, and we know what will prevent them. Simple checklists of things that hospitals can do.
You know, those are the kinds of things that I have enough interest in that I'm going to say to the conferees, you guys have to make sure that that's included, because part of the deal here is not just providing more coverage or more subsidies but we keep on spending twice as much as every other advanced country and we have worse outcomes. Part of our goal is to spend our money more wisely, because if we don't do that, then it doesn't matter how many subsidies we have in there, how many taxes we impose. Sooner or later we start running out of money; it gobbles more and more of our overall federal budget and families' budgets.
JIM LEHRER: And let's say, for instance, the public-option plan: It's in the House version; it's not in the Senate version.
PRESIDENT OBAMA: Right.
JIM LEHRER: All right. What's going to be your position when you sit down and talk about this?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: You know, look, I've been in favor of the public option. I think the more choice, the more competition we have, the better.
On the other hand, I think that the exchange itself, the system that we're setting up that forces insurance companies to essentially bid for three million or four million or five million people's business, that in and of itself is going to have a disciplining effect.
Would I like one of those options to be the public option? Yes. Do I think that it makes sense, as some have argued, that, without the public option, we dump all these other extraordinary reforms and we say to the 30 million people who don't have coverage, "You know, sorry. We didn't get exactly what we wanted?" I don't think that makes sense.
JIM LEHRER: So it is not - that's not a deal-breaker for you in any - any way, either way.
PRESIDENT OBAMA: I think - I think, right now, that the Senate and the House bills - if you look at their overlap, the 95 percent that they agree on - if that bill was presented to me -
JIM LEHRER: You'd sign it?
PRESIDENT OBAMA: - I would sign it.
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an inexperienced political hack in over his head talking to a shill for the establishment doesn't thrill me.
Obams is going to please his corporate pay masters and blow smoke up are asses with his happy talk. I will bet any amount of money that this piss ant is a one term President. When his term is up he is going to make Cheney's pathedic approval ratings look high.
now when he speaks it reminds me of polished shyster lawyers and car salesmen that I have had to listen to throughout my life. Go back to Chicago and take Emanuel with you.
with 3 more years of this Bull shit? I wonder who will be lift to support him, I mean Opra is retiring right? I used to laugh at all the CONservatives that fell for GWB's BS. Now I feel raped by this SOB. I have always been an Independent but I am registering as a Dem so I can vote against Obama in the Dem primary if they have one.
switch from Democrat to Independent as soon as this hcr turd is finalized; I feel I can no longer 'enable' the Democratic Party in any way, since it has become undeniably clear that its real master is the corporations (with a few crumbs thrown the people's way). However, I would love to vote against Obama in the primary. Perhaps I should register as Independent, re-register as a Democratic in 2012 in time for the primary, then back to Independent... anything not to have to hear or see that shyster polluting the airways.
George Carlin had an observation about crumbs. He said:
I wonder if the 95% includes getting re-elected, because I don't think that's going to happen. Obama has sold out on so many fronts that it's getting hard to keep track of them all.
How about what I want??????? or it does not matter???????
Who, in poll after poll, have said they want a public option.What about them (us)? This is nothing more than Clinton Conservatism all over again.How totally un-inspiring and non-hopeful.Doesn't anybody in that party have any spine?
wants, even though something like only 30% of the American people like this bill. This is what Obama wanted all along, a present to the insurance/hospital/pharma lobbyists and his campaign coffers filled to perpetuity. What a smug a** and conman!! I can't stand to listen to him anymore. 2 NPR commentators said yesterday that this bill will actually make healthcare even more expensive, will be unsustainable and that in 5-7 years the entire "reformed" system will collapse.
And now for the next betrayal...he wants to sit in on the rest of the hcr process, probably so he can make sure the insurance industry gets the remaining 5%. This is/has never been about the American people, obviously.
You might be right, but who have you got thats better?
When someone suggested expanded rights for workers to organize and join unions, Rooseveldt said "Great idea, now go out there and make me do it!"
Same thing with "public option", or single payer. Why not completely eliminate the age restriction for medicare so that medicare covers you from the day you're born as we do here in Canada. It works pretty well for us. It covers vertually everyone,and it costs a lot less.
Polls indicate that a massive majority of Americans, well over 60%, support some kind of public option. If Americans who were for a public option or single payer organized massive demostrations, if the labour movement organized work stoppages in protest of the newmandate without the protection of the government option.
If Americans actually went out into the streets with their demands, if they threw a proverbial wrench into this process, which is nothing if it is not corrupt.
But don't blame Obama. He couldn't do it if he wanted to. You have to make him want to, and you have to communicate it to your politicians that you won't let them bamboozle you again.
Your biggest problem is that your politicians don't have to listen to you. They get elected by listeming to their sponsers, the corporations.
Question becomes, how do you make them hear you, and take you seriously.
isn't American Idol on?
'But don't blame Obama. He couldn't do it if he wanted to. You have to make him want to, and you have to communicate it to your politicians that you won't let them bamboozle you again.'
Where've you been? Have you not heard about the mandate--FROM THE PEOPLE?
You're excuses for this sorry piece of legislation are unfortunate and simply repeat democratic/corporate talking points. When people believe this is the best we can do, it only seals our fate as exploitable and gullible...and ensures that the corportists will next try this nonsense with Medicare and Social Security.
You misunderstand. You don't seem to understand your own system of gov't.
As long as people allow their politicians to ignore them THEY WILL. Its the same everywhere.
You can't elect them than them ignore them. They'll betray you every time.
A few years ago, in Denmark, hundreds of thousands of people went out in the streets to demand 5 weeks vacation each year.
I'll bet capitalists in Denmark apposed this idea, but the Danish politicians were more afraid of the citizenry than the capitalists, and today, Danes get (by law) 5 weeks of vacation.
As Michael Moore observed in "Sicko", in Europe the governments are afraid of the people, while in America, the people are afraid of their government.
Thats why the Europeans are living better, more secure lives than their American counterparts.
I agree that we need substanially better organization and to understand the importance of protest. Absolutely!
But my larger point--and what's so frightening--is that the corportists have such a stranglehold on (mis)information, on elected officials, on power, they are able to their way even though a solid majority may be against it.
BTW, I loved that bit in Sicko with the expats; unfortunately, that's not America in 2009. What to do when the government spends all its time scaring the hell out of people? It seems to work.
I think in very difficult circumstances Obama is doing a great job.
In less than a year he has turned the economy around, taking it from falling off a cliff to 3% growth.
He has also about to pass the biggest piece of healthcare legislation in decades.
Pretty impressive for less than one year and given the conditions he entered office into.
The country is clearly going in a better direction.
Obama and his boss Emanuel never wanted a single payer or a public option from the very first..
Emanuel and Obama made their dirty deals with the insurance company and they placed the very persons they wanted to carry out that process..
Baucus , Nelson , Lieberman , Mary and the rest were just doing the job Emanuel and Obama assign to them...
I do not see why most of us have not figured this out yet,,, But Obama & Emanuel are both a phony and a fraud...
you get the picture perfectly.
"Obama and his boss Emanuel never wanted a single payer or a public option from the very first..."
When I realized I'd been had by Obama, I was pissed. Man the truth fucking hurts :-(
Somebody's not getting re-elected.
Do they really expect us to buy this?
Consider yourself lucky to see through the facade.
I'd almost rather be ignorant of the truth.
Happy Holidays Everyone!
You can't mandate that everyone purchase health insurance, requiring everyone to purchase from the insurance companies and then do nothing to fix the issues with the insurance companies that we needed reform in the first place.
This whole endeavor has been botched from the very beginning. Both the House and Senate started their respective bills with compromises, instead of starting with single payer and the President never provided good leadership. Instead, the President made deals with the insurance and pharmaceutical companies for them to keep their insane profits.
Either give us an option to buy into Medicare if you are going to mandate health insurance or scrap this folly.
Otherwise the WH goons have instructed the Press to not expect Obama to be saying much till Jan 4th. He's off limits to the Press while "vacationing".
Great you may personally not want to buy insurance from private insurers, but I do not know what you were expecting. No one ever promised you that they were going to get rid or private insurance. The public option was also never going to be that large and the most recent versions were only ever going to insure less than 10 million or only about 3% of the population.
Great you are expecting a jump straight to single payer, but that was never on the table.
You need to read the bill. There is tons of new rules and regulations for insurance companies. The biggest being the elimination of pre-existing conditions.
This is a very good bill and a start to reform.
It will funnel $100s of billions to millions of people to subsidize their healthcare.
Not sure where you get this ideal that deals were made with insurance companies. Lets see some proof of that.
Medicare is being expanded in quite a large way under this bill.
"The bill provides very impressive subsidies to working-class people, in some cases providing them with in excess of $10,000 worth of assistance per year. Perhaps more importantly, as Jonathan Cohn and Jonathan Gruber have outlined, it radically reduces the downside risk to lower-income families because of annual caps on out-of-pocket expenses. And -- something that hasn't gotten enough attention -- the bill increases the Medicaid threshold from 100 percent to 133 percent of poverty; about half of the assistance in the program is devoted to that Medicaid expansion."
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/12/postsc...
how well the President has done, let's consider this.
It is not likely democrats will have a stronger control of government than they do right now for quite some time so any ammendments to this bill you see as being positive and favoring the working class, how so? Once the insurance industry is granted even more power than they have now through almost total control of our national healthcare, what makes you think they will become less powerful in their influence of legislation? We've all read of dozens of loopholes that will allow I.C.'s to run pretty much as usual. I, for one, don't have faith that our government will adequately enforce the regulations that may squeak through the final version of the bill. Others have this faith, I understand. Our recent history shows us that Fox's are allowed to Police the Henhouse, why do you think healthcare will be any different?
We weren't expecting single payer, but there are countries that function quite well with both private and government run insurance. I think that's what most of us wanted/expected.
On a further note (and a pet peeve of mine) where does all the money that's being funneled to the I.C.'s get made up as pertaining to the rest of the economy?
See, if we mandate "x" amount go to insurers that means "x" less is available for everything else.
La la land indeed.
You have very high expectations, particularly given that Obama entered office facing the single largest recession since the depression. The fact that he has not completely thrown his agenda out the window because of the recession is quite remarkable.
As for your point about the democratic majority, you are right, except the majorities mean relatively little when you need a super-majority or 60 votes to pass any meaningful legislation. Two reasons why the 60 votes makes it now impossible to pass meaningful legislation is (1) the democrats have a very big tent. there is not a "progressive" majority, but only a democratic majority with several democratic senators much more conservative than your average democrat. so in reality yes the democrats have a senate majority, but not really a strong one; and (2) zero Republicans are willing to work with the democrats on anything meaningful. At least when Bush was president he still almost always got a handful of democrats voting with him.
So the democratic majority argument is not a strong one. It is really more of a Republican talking point. You just cannot assume it will be easy to pass any really progressive piece of legislation.
I am not sure the insurance industry has been granted more control over national health insurance. Prove it. By putting 10s of millions more on health insurance that never had it before and by adding many new regulations for the insurers? In fact, they have been given less control, given for example no pre-exisiting conditions. Healthcare insurance company stocks were actully down last week.
see: http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/12/health...
If you were expecting a new private/public system then you and progressives should have fought for it. I saw no evidence that progressives were fighting for it and making Obama's job any easier as he battled the biggest lobbies on the planet in trying to convince the blue dogs and the american people that stronger reform was needed.
fighting for a more progressive bill you were watching or reading something controlled by the "liberal" press.
and fell sleep halfway into it. Obama has never, ever been a direct talker, I saw this coming from the beginning of his campaign, which is why I wanted to grit my teeth and vote for Clinton -- not because I figured she'd usher in a revolution, but because I think that she had so much experience in dealing with the wingnuts, that she had been placed in the position of losing healthcare once already and had to promise to resurrect.
I have started to wonder lately what Clinton would have done differently.
I always had the impression that Obama was too willing to kiss ass if he needed. If anyone remembers, he was the one who backed down and went and into his "religious values" when denying rights to gay folks, thinking he could kiss ass to the wingnut faction of the democrat party.
I ignore my better thoughts thinking I'm too critical.
I see now that possibly my first impression of him was accurate. He ain't no fighter.
it doesn't matter what he says or does. come 2012 the republicans will run sarah the crazy and you will virulently support him.
I voted for President Obama, but I never supported him. He was the lesser of two evils, the greater evil being Senator McCain.
Boy, if that's gonna be choice, I see absolutely no hesitation or no problem in supporting him.
Was this a set-up?
we the people are going to be fucked no matter what, we might as well get a laugh out of it.
Obama has done so much damage to the Liberal cause by prretending to be everything we were looking for. Now that we Liberals have our savior we will be blamed for all this countries ills. I still can't believe this SOB is still trying to BS us. I can't wait to hear his sales pitch for the 2012 election, it is going to be a duzzy.
this is a sham BS interview because Jim Lehrer does not even ask about the backstabbing Big Pharma deal that Obuma made with Big Corp. Lehrer was probably given a list of things not to be discussed by Emanuel and told to have a drink of their very own Christmas Kool Aid.
Let's get the Bill, Obama can sign it. Then, a government agency (or if needed the Dems) should publish a booklet containing short, concise detailing of what's in it. Not just related to individual insurance, but the whole scope of changes being brought to the existing system.
And send it out to every household. Why? So that the Repubs can't just spin it the way they want.
I've sent a similar request to my two Senators.
1. Buy health insurance at work or on the new exchange;
2. Avoid using insurance due to co-pays, deductibles and out-of-pocket maximum exposures – not to mention lost work time and the worry about losing one’s job in a tough economy;
3. If symptoms are noticed, treat by internet medical site suggestions and over-the-counter drugs until no other option but going to a doctor are available;
4. Attempt to make appointment with doctor but first find one who accepts both new patients and your insurance;
5. Go to doctor and pay co-pay up front before ever speaking to anyone about medical problem;
6. Sit in outer waiting room for as long as required, missing work and worrying;
7. Sit in exam room waiting for doctor for as long as required;
8. See doctor for five or six minutes, if lucky, during which time you will either be prescribed some expensive drug to fix a problem the doctor isn’t sure you have, referred to another doctor who may have a month or two wait for appointments, be directed to get some tests done you aren’t sure your insurance will allow or pay for, and do it all sitting in your underwear or less;
9. Leave medical office owing more than what you thought your insurance and co-pay advertised (and never get an explanation for how that is possible) and never sure if this experience was much different than being to a used car lot where the sales folks have assessed your financing mechanism before showing you anything at all and then only show you what fits the financing not what you need or want;
10. In the alternative, if you collapse or wait until symptoms get so severe that going for an office appointment is impossible, go to an emergency room – repeat steps five through eight – and either be admitted to the hospital if your insurance is adequate and you have any available sick-time from work (if not, beg for drugs and to be released) or go to number nine.
11. Need a dentist? Too bad. Have dental insurance? Still too bad. You might get a cleaning and some x-rays, but getting the care you may or may not need will be again totally related to your ability to pay whatever portion of the dental work is not covered (and amazingly, every penny of what dental insurance will cover will be eaten up by whatever problem you may or may not have) – in the alternative, avoid dentists or just pull teeth as they go bad;
12. When the bills roll in, try to pay some after trying to find out how you can possible owe hundreds if not thousands more than the insurance policy you have indicates is possible;
13. When the collectors call to collect all of the balances due, try to negotiate payments but endure threats of lawsuit, garnishment and worse as the collectors report back to the doctors you saw for a few moments in number eight;
14. Try to get your meds – if too costly, go without;
15. Try to get well – if you cannot, go back to work;
16. Try to act like this is all wonderful and you are grateful to have any insurance at all;
17. Get sued by a collection agency for a doctor bill or hospital bill you cannot cover;
18. Sell your house and use whatever proceeds you have to try to pay some of the debts;
19. Collectors for the doctors and hospitals are not happy if you don’t pay it all in full and up-front most of the time;
20. Feel stress, fear, anguish – but don’t gripe and don’t show it at work – buck it up, chump;
21. Sell keepsakes and anything valuable to try to stay afloat;
22. Stress, more stress. Fear to answer the phone. Friends and family fall away as they don’t want you to ask to borrow money;
23. Keep working – sick or not, keep working or you’ll lose that damn insurance if you cannot pay the premium – or you’ll be back out on the exchange trying to buy another policy that is cheaper and even worse;
24. Watch your elected officials claim victory and history as they work to make sure your kids and grandkids must suffer the same fate if they need healthcare in America;
Doesn't sound like spin to me. Sounds like a pretty good description of the "perfect storm" with the
current health care system.
Obama actually wanted to screw us all over.
Yeah, that was his intention all along. Sorry, I don't buy it. But I also suggest reading or getting well acquainted with what's in the expected Bill besides just the insurance companies.
Not if it drives wingnuts to these kinds of actions:
http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009...
Of the sell job both parties are involved in. One person stands up and objects, sits down, and another.. and another... takes his/her place.They do this for months on end,with the gracious help of the tea baggers, until NO ONE knows what's going on. Then one day, magically, Whoo hoo, "WE have 60 votes"!!"We've got a really mediocre bill here, but damitt I'm gonna vote for it".or " This bill does not address most of my constituents concerns but heck, the president likes it, so I'll vote for it and we'll fix all the bad parts later".or "It's a real victory for the American people"!Of course, the real american people were never consulted. Do you believe this crap??
First it's 95% of what he wanted. Next it's he'd be happy with the 95% that the Senate and House bills agree on. If he keeps pulling 95% statistics out of his ass, how long before we end up with 0%?
We have already ended up with 0%.
Is there noting we can do about it?
Don't know, but you can try. You'd have to organize and make a lot of noise, and create a lot of inconvenience for them, but you could convince them that a mandate without a public option would be political suicide for them.
And you've got to be believable.
Maybe you can do it if you try, maybenot, but you won't for sure if you don't try.
The dems are a bunch of clueless fucks that can't agree enough to get anything done even with a super majority and the repigs just want to rob you blind. Welcome to the American system, not working for the majority of the country for 233 years now.
Did anyone ever expect change just because a politician ran on change? They all lie, it's their job.
... slick willy in your face double cross since the valentines day massacre. The black guy shoved it up whitey's ass.
I can't vote for this guy... even if it's Sarah! A least I know where she stands.
you truly are insane.
then you hate America
Sure. Vote for Sarah who believes that the earth is 5,000 years old and man existed with dinosaurs. Also, for the party that doesn't give two shits about you or anyones health care. Join the crazy tea bagger party now in order to get a head start. With a comment like "the black guy and whitey," you'll be welcomed with open arms.
Obama got 95% of what he wanted.
And we got 0.
The best comment for sure.
We are not fools. Do you really believe that once you open your mouth we will be apeased. For christ sake DON'T take us for granted.
We would would love to give you a second term.
Never mind what you want
What about what we need?
Nobody is going to give it to you.
Go after the dems the way the teabaggers have gone after the reps.
Organize, mobilize and channel the public anger that is rising over this betrayal of health care reform.
Don't count on the politicians. Most of them are counting on their sponsers to help them buy your vote.
You have to make it clear to them A What you want - medicare for all
and B That you are aware of exactly what they are doing, why they are doing it, who is funding them, and what factor this will play in the next election, or next primary.
More might be needed. Civil disobedience, demonstrations in the streets in front of, and perhaps even occupations of the major health insurance company headquarters, as well as offices of Senators and Congressmen demanding the termination of the age restriction to medicare.
And I think that women especially have to get organized on this thing. The bill, as it presently stand will make it almost impossible to get insurance to cover abortion proceedures, should they ever be necessary. As I understand it, women have achieved certain reproductive rights which this bill threatens to make it impossible to actually use their rights.
Remember what Joe Hill said. "Don't mourn, organize."
Are these people getting 95% of what they need?
http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/18278
If not---you have much more work to do. Don't try to placate us with your politics of good intentions---we need results, not empty promises. We are not fools--we know the difference between the two and will remember you and your party come election time.
I just hope you don't have such short memories that you forget the previous 8 years.
But Obama does not get a pass on accountability. either. I know the crooked road cannot be straightened in a fortnight but we need straight talk, not hype.
Obama attempted and actually is about to pass the biggest piece of healthcare legislation in the last several decades.
Are you that small that you are writing the guy off because he did not get you everything that you personally wanted?
This bill is a huge achievement.
Given that we are in a huge recesssion, running record deficits and it has been less than one year, I would say that Obama has been able to do is pretty admirable.
If you want to express anger you should express it for the Repulicans as not one of them supported healthcare reform and I am sure quite a few of them came from your states.
Complete BS that a state like Texas has 25% without insurance and not one of their Republican politicians was willing to work with Democrats to push for healthcare reform.
you believe this liar shouldn't allow you to be so condescending and self righteous towards people who are truly angry and disappointed, not to mention heart broken about this elitist bullshit artist who promised so much transparency and justice for hardworking Americans then turned right around and stabbed us in the back. The American People deserve more than this after 8 years of Bush and Cheney as well as no relief from near economic collapse, constant war to support Big Oil, judicial meltdown with constant attacks on the Constitution, continued and expanded wiretapping, no prosecutions for war crimes and torture, bailing out the banksters and protecting the most criminal bank of them all Goldman Sachs, etc., etc. Go ahead continue to believe the lies from this sorcerer,s apprentice. Many of us will not and we have the right not to.
that I'm a little more mature than you but I don't want to waste one of our national holidays whining. Am I disappointed with the results so far, yes. The bills still have to be reconciled by the house and senate so I didn't get a crystal ball for Christmas so I don't yet know what the final bill will be. I would like to say happy holidays but I doubt if it would do you any good.
I did.
What was his name? Clinton?
I just hope you don't have such convenient memories.
This bill is total Corporate Ambrosia. I don’t care what the the big O-Hole says.Seasons CURSES on him & his family & Corporate Friends. May they NEVER have a happy day forever. Screw Him thoroughly.
So Glad I decided not to vote for him after the telecom Immunity non-filibuster & never donated a dime. I can’t recall ever hating the crapulous slime of Bush/Cheney half so much. NO MORE DEMOCRATS or Repugs. & a special screw Rahm.
Barely care enough to comment. People are so stupid!
Happy Holidays to all!
"I'M GETTING WHAT "I" WANT.." I'm a disappointed Democrat who worked religiously to help get Obama elected President...He has been a never ending source of disappointment to Democrats, Independents & centrists alike. This man is an ego maniac...Totally full of himself...thinking he's king of the world..When Rep. Rangel criticized Obama's policies, Obama called and asked Rangel why he was "demeaning" him, When Danny Glover critized him, it was all about lining up African Americans who loved him on one side of the room and AA's like Danny Glover who don't on the other side!!...Amazing! I don't listen to his flowery little speeches anymore, he is more giftwrap than gift,more sizzle than steak...phony as a 3 dollar bill, and I hope to God, is 1 term President. His is turning into the RahmObama Presidency, complete with Chicago style thuggery. This Rahm dude gives me the creeps just like Karl Rove did. We may as well have a lying Republican President with a deceitful bunch of crooks & schemers around him as a Democratic one.
He TRULY thinks we're all idiots. Woody got it right, Obama is an egomaniac. The emperor has no clothes and he takes his orders from Rahm, the "health" insurance companies and the pharmaceutical companies.
Can we PLEASE get a credible third or fourth party candidate in 2012? I'll take Nader right about now.
In the American "two party, first past the post electoral system, Progressive third party candidates usually end up helping Republican candidates, while right-wing third party candidates, end up helping to elect Democrats.
You've got to do what the "teabaggers" are doing to the Reps.
Make them afraid of you. Let them know that you feel betrayed and your very angry, and that they better not do this without a strong public option.
Uh, no, Mr. President, the insurance lobby got 95% of what THEY wanted (and don't worry, they'll still be pushing for the other 5%). Working and Middle-class Americans got zilch, zero, nada, jackshit.
Democrats, Republicans -- it's all surface theatrics to disguise the truly powerful party beneath the D/R label, the Corporate Party.
Exactly. The D's and R's play the good cop / bad cop, but they all represent the same things, and its not the will or interests of the American people but rather the needs and interests of their corporate sponsers.
I think journalism might be inproved if whenever reporting on a politician, his chief sources of money and support should be included, so that as matter of course for example, when a story such as Lieberman's statement on the public option, the story would typically be reported as "Senator Lieberman, who received "X" amount of $ from health insurance company "A", and "Y" amount from health insurance company "B", and "Z" from health insurance company "C", says that he cannot even allow debate on any bill that includes any kind of publi option.
I think that their sponsership should be brought to the foreground. This Senator is brought to you by...
Sunlight is is a great disinfectant.
have given the Republicans and Conservatives what they want for Xmas....political suicide.
Obama started turning his back on his supporters when he had Rick Warren preach at his inauguration. Then keeping Gitmo open. Then stopping investigations into torture, etc, etc. The hits keep on coming from this guy.
He really is a Socialist as he just added Insurance companies to his list of welfare recipients.
Barack Obuma appointed eleven members of the Trilateral Commission to top-level and key positions in his administration within the his first ten days in office.
If he came out and admitted the bill is a wreak and will be worked on and then he will see what it ends up being I could stand with Obama. But No he got to pretend he got 95% of what he wanted a bullshit number which does more damage then good. If he's lying to pad his ego that's bad enough, if he's not lying then he never had any intention of putting real reform on the table and that’s even worse.
At one time, I used to visit C&L on a daily basis because the dialogue seemed to be sane and I liked to catch up on the news of the day. But since I will soon be removing it from my favorites, are there any non snarky posters who can recommend a web site which has some reasonable dialogue? Or at least some follow up explanations of how the Republicans are going to win big in 2010 and 2012? You know, the party of crazy, religious, racist people who haven't offered one idea about how to fix health care, the economy or anything at all? Reasonable dialogue on a blog. Does such a place exist?
I'm beginning to agree with you about this web site, judging by the comments. For Democrats/liberals/progressives to so eagerly turn on Obama is disheartening to say the least. I guess they'd rather the Republicans be back in charge. I believe Obama is doing the best he can with the circumstances he inherited and within our political system. He has no choice but to play the hand he was dealt, and I believe he's done a lot of positive things, including taking a giant step forward on healthcare reform. The way I see it is we have to start somewhere. Half the battle is winning the hearts and minds of the American people on this issue, getting them to understand that it's a moral and economic necessity, not some socialistic/communistic plot, which is what the righties were saying about Medicare and Social Security.
Just follow the bouncing ball.
Perfect example of how the game is intended to be played. Put a republican in office disguised as a super-smart, smooth-talking liberal democrat who seems 180 degrees removed from george bush--a person so appealing, it would be tough to get people to disagree with what he does, no matter how outrageous.
Then, to seal the deal, ensure the other party is taken over by a bunch of raving, out-of-control, outrageous, extreme-to-the-max lunies so that even if people end up vehemently disagreeing with the dems, they will gratefully vote for them, to keep the lunies at bay.
Touché!
want the repubs back, but neither do I want O saying one thing but doing another. I will not be a "sycophant" for anyone. Nor will I or do I attack posters, but I am allowed in some part of the constitution to state my opinions, until O continues on with the fraud of the "Patriot Act" and takes away what's left.
O cannot say "no one is above the law" and then block every effort to bring bushco to account.
O cannot say "our strengths is our freedoms" and then do nothing to role back bushco on fisa, habeus corpus etc.
O cannot say "we do not torture" and then have his Justice Dept argue successfully before scotus, that there is no protections against torture in "American" prisons not in the US.
During the campaign, Obama said on several occasions that we're going to have to make some hard choices. If his leadership style in promoting health care reform is indicative of his support for progressive programs, Social Security and Medicare are in big trouble. This guy is a weak stick and will sell us out to special interests. Change We Can Believe In my ass - I want to change my damn vote.
if true.
Obama is a PR man for the Central Bankers who run this country. He will not solve your problems, he is not the answer; he is the problem along with the Federal Government who are completely out of control.
How about a campaign where we ALL DROP our health insurance on JULY 4TH 2010??? How about practicing non-cooperation and drop this crap insurance system. DO NOT FEED THE BEAST. A few million of us would scare the crap out of them. LET'S DO IT!!!
frickin spoiled crybabies. Democrats are still patting themselves on the back for getting their butts out of the Lazyboy and actually voting in 2008. And for that extraordinary sacrifice they expect to get sweeping social reforms delivered to their doorsteps by Publisher's Clearinghouse. Wake up whiners! it doesn't work that way. If the extent of your political activism is writing snarky comments on a blog, then you deserve what you're getting. As over-the-top as the teabag brigade is, they get it. If you want something bad enough, you have to hit the streets and fight for it down to the wire. Blue collar workers in labor unions get it. Their leadership tells them if you want it, go fight for it and they show up after working a 60 hour week. So where were all the fancy-pants progressives marching and raising their voices for health care reform? Sitting at home trying to prove the teabaggers were inflating their numbers with bad Photoshops?
Obama said, again and again, this year "don't make the public option the be-all and end-all;" "don't make it a wedge;" "it's only a very small piece of reform." Was anyone listening - or were we just hearing what we want to hear? Or were we screaming too loud for Obama to do what we should have been doing - getting more involved? Sheeeesh.
in 2012. You betcha!
Obama went to war on healthcare and progressives and his voters failed to show-up.
It is a joke that all you idiots sit on here and complain, when none of you made it any easier to pass strong healthcare reform.
Where were the progressive millions and their hundreds of millions of dollars. Progressives lost the messaging war to the other side who were better organized and more vocal. You should have been flooding the townhalls.
In any event this is a good bill and will make life much better for tens of millions. It is also a start to reform.
in the differential of your car are a very small piece, but you're not going very far without them, as is this insurance reform bill towards actually helping anyone, except the insurance companies.
Any bill that leaves on an annual basis 5 times as many people were killed on 9/11 to die because of lack of insurance, can not by any measure be called a successful accomplishment.
You're free to disagree of course, but if you do, would you kindly put forward one of your family members as one of the 15,000 who will die because of no health insurance.
Nope, I won't do it. I won't pay a penny to the vampires sucking the blood out of America's health care system.
I guess you'd all be praising Pres. Mccain and his vp palin.. You cant always get what you want, but I am beginning to think you all want everything to just be handed to you...
When Iranians believed that the election had been stolen, they were out in the streets in the hundreds of thousands to protest the theft of the election.
When Ukrainians thought their election had been stolen in Dec. 2004, thousands of people camped out in the streets of Kiev for weeks in the winter cold to protest.
When George W. Bush stole the elections of 2000 and again in 2004, Americans bitched and complained about it on line, but that was about it. So what do you expect?
Obviously, Americans don't really care about democracy as much as Iranians or Ukrainians do.
calling it what it was - the theft of the Presidency. If they had, maybe the protests would have materialized. As it was, they protrayed what happened as a spoiled democorat trying to wrest the Presidency from the "right"ful winner.
Of course, then you have the untold millions stupid enough to beieive that.
"the land of the free and the home of the brave" myth.
Boy McCain and Palin would have really been pushing healthcare reform.... I would hate to think were this country would be right now if those two were in power. McCain actually said during the campaign that there was no economic problem.
The Key word here is "I'M" Getting 95 Percent of what i want.
I guess that all we are getting is the 5% He is not getting and Nothing More. The Bush Era Continues...$
If you did not get all you wanted in this healthcare reform bill, then you can only blame yourselves.
Obama went to war on healthcare and his supporters and progressives largely did not show up.
The other side was way more organized and vocal. Where were the $100s millions of progressive dollars and the mass pro-healthcare reform rallies. If there was so much support for much more stronger reform, then why where the progressives not swamping the townhall meetings.
You cannot just elect your people, and sit back and do nothing. It does not work that way anymore, particularly given how big the Democratic tent is. Given that you now need 60 votes to pass anything substantial, progressives need to convince all senators that it is in their interest to vote on any particular piece of legislation. No easy feat when there are many different senators from across the political spectrum in the democratic party.
Two reasons why stronger reform did not pass:
1) the recession; it was a major distraction for the Obama adminstration, almost killing everthing else and certainly putting a major freeze on the Obama agenda. If we had a much stronger economy I am sure the blue dogs would have felt much more secure in their seats and had been more willing to vote for stronger healthcare reform.
2) progressives largely did not show up for the war and lost the messaging battle for the hearts and minds of the American people. How the hell do the majority of Americans now not support healthcare reform? You lost the messaging war. Easy to sit here on these websites and preach to the converted, but you needed to be in the townhalls and in the streets and raising money. The other side was.
Easy to whine and bitch and complain about Obama, but at the end of the day he did bring healthcare up for reform, which was no small feat in this brutual economy. He did go to war, although I am sure some of you will disagree with his style and method, but they made their political calculations in a very difficult environment.
Like Clinton once said regarding Don't Ask and Don't Tell, he wanted to change the policy, but the democratic voters did not rally the troops, or at least rally their congressmen and congress women to get him the votes and support he needed.
Democracy in America has to be much more interactive. It is now that way on the other side. Say what you want about the teabaggers, but at least they are active, vocal and rally the troops. You may discount them because they are a small group, but they will rally their base to vote, which may make the difference in 2010, particularly if the progressives do not show up to vote.
[Edit: QUIT SPAMMING-Sitemonitor]
station broadcasting right wing lies 24/7 counters that. Multiply that by the hundreds of radion/television shows around the country and we are totally outmaned.
on these sites is just preaching to the converted.
People needed to be demanding single-payer loud and clear. They should have been putting the politicians on the spot on single payer during the campaign and from the beginning of this reform process.
The reality is that the reason there has was no big rally around single-payer is because there is no large support for it in the country.
Bitch and complain all you want about not getting the most progressive bill, but the reality is this bill is still a huge achievement.
Should we have risked getting shot by confronting Teabaggers. Should we have gone face to face with right wing lunatic goons who were bused in from place to place and organized by FOX news?
Most of us did what we've been taught to do. Write, call, e-mail, sign petitions and follow through with your representative or Senator. As for me, all I got in return were aides who didn't know the Senators stance, or a canned e-mail in response. But that's just me. I'd venture a bet that millions of people received the same response I did.
It was up to our representatives to follow through on the will of the people they represent. I don't believe they did that. You do.
We can disagree.
White House Press Release no doubt.
Why would you say that because someone express a different view than you?
You are just as narrow minded as these right wing idiots.
"your in lala land" and "blame yourselves". That's not a good way to start if you want others to see your side.
what exactly does that have to do with a white house press release though?
many of the comments here by these cry babies sound a lot like the ridiculous logic you can read on conservative websites.
we did not exactly get what we wanted so Obama is a traitor, a shame, a etc. etc. etc.
Conservatives must be laughing all the way to 2010.. the reality is that this bill should be considered a huge victory for democrats and a big loss of the republicans..
who could have ever imagined that Obama would be able to deliver hundreds of billions of dollars to provide healthcare to tens of millions during the biggest economic downturn since the great depression.
can't even have a rational discourse there is no need for anyone to address you as you portray yourself as nothing more than a democratic shill.
Too bad. If you actually had points to make I might have bothered to read the rest of your post.
Whatever you want to believe?
not much rational discourse on here? a lot of angry people that some how thought everything would be fixed in this country in less than one year during the most challenging of times...
how Obuma apologists like to blame progressives for not doing enough. They try to deflect the fact their leader is a liar and a con artist.
I don't think anyone is apologizing for obama. just being a realist! you must be some conservative wing-nut, as your "liar" and "con artist" comment makes you sound just like one... by the way can you give us an example of where obama exactly lied and sounded like a con artist please? just one
So the insurance companies pay to Obama is $190 million instead of $200 million and he's happy with that bribe.
has gotta get his cut too.
steaming pile of S*** is 95% of what he wanted, he should be ashamed.
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