Someone Needs to Tell Mort Zuckerman That Light Rail is Infrastructure
By Heather Monday Oct 12, 2009 4:00pm
After having the majority of the unequally balanced panel on the McLaughlin Group trash the stimulus package as not having worked to create jobs and being politicized, Mort Zuckerman throws this gem out there.
Zuckerman: I disagree with the way you're describing this stimulus program. It was maybe perhaps well intentioned, completely badly conceived. It did not focus on unemployment. It does not focus on those kinds of activities that in fact could create jobs.
I'm just going to remind you of one example. When you have Harry Reid, the Majority Leader in the Senate getting a $350 million grant for a UniRail to go from Las Vegas to Disneyland, you know where a lot of this money went. It's almost a farce. And we, unemployment is much worse than those numbers and it's going to be worse and be higher next year at this time than it is this year.
McLaughlin: What do you...
Zuckerman: And the Republicans are going to--34% of all people have had either a family member or close friend unemployed.
McLaughlin: If you were designing this stimulus, how would you have changed what the stimulus is?
Zuckerman: I would have put a heck of a lot more money into infrastructure development and focused on that. A lot of the money that went in for a lot of pet programs for the Democratic Party that had virtually no affect in terms of stimulating the economy and having a multiplier.
Yes, Mort Zuckerman's hatred for Harry Reid seems to have melted his brain to the point that he is complaining about an infrastructure project in one breath and saying we need more in the next. And he was McLaughlin's guest on the "left" side of the room. Zuckerman was crying about this project on one of the MSNBC programs last week as well, but I don't remember him saying we needed more infrastructure projects right after he did it.
h/t Digby
Update: h/t FilthyHarry
I appears Mort Zuckerman did do the same thing the other day on MSNBC's Morning Joe.
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My God ... the stupidity and dishonesty, all together in one.
McLaughlin, Zuckerman, that pig Buchanan, and that Palin wannabe Crowley, just shamelessly bully, talk over and dominate poor lonely old Eleanor Clift.
http://crooksandliars.com/comment/permalink/1316636
The BS was that the train was supposed to go from Disneyland to, depending on the version of the story, the Bunny Ranch in Carson City or the Mustang Ranch in Reno.
I remember the story, then remember hearing about it being debunked, but didn't care enough to check what was what. But I knew BS when I heard it.
when you first posted it, I'd have added it to the post. I work full time and do video work for the site along with the posts I do here that don't make the front page, so I don't get a lot of time to check out the comments. I'll add your comment to the post.
I just like to run my suck. You never need to justify to me.
noticed that he did do it twice since I missed it. So I didn't mind adding it for that reason. Makes Mort look worse for repeating this nonsense.
(damn, it's gotten baaad) and caught Mort babbling about this. I thought the show was a repeat from a few months back (when the whole thing was, sadly, debunked).
that stupidity does not know geography boundaries. And that net worth is not directly correlated with the validity of one's opinions on anything.
Since he flies on his own private jet, he must have assumed that light rail is just for the poor unwashed masses, and thus unworthy on his "hard earned" tax dollars.
Yeah, there's an objective rag.Why not just invite Beck and Orally.
from LV to Disney?
That's awfully cheap and stinks of cost over run.
Try 100 billion $$$ .
wow where did you get that number? whatever it is the corporation/casinos should put in some dough.
in some respects it's probably not a terrible idea. the corridor is used heavily so air pollution and saving fuel. not to overlook this corridor is dangerous. LA is a big draw for vegas. unless the cost is big time i believe it could a good move overall.
My guess on this one is based on real world money
by using Bay Area Rapid Transit as a benchmark costing model.
I remember touring the BART station at North Berkeley after its first day of operation. The mosaic walls were all shiny and clean.
For Las Vegas, the cost for a new system isn't simply rail itself.
1. Security force. 24/7/365 monitoring.
2. Bridges, stations, parking lots with public and security access roads.
3. Electricity, lighting and communications to run the trains at all right-of-ways including backup power generation and other safety redundancies.
4. Insurance or bonds to use against injury, death or material loss.
5. Administrative facilities (offices for principals, white collar and blue collar workers).
6. Union scale wages and benefits with provisions for strike security.
7. Administrative fleet of cars, vans, SUV's, huge utility trucks, patrol/rescue aircraft along with oil price contractual agreements and storage facilities.
8. Reserve material and personnel (extra board/fleet/administration) to operate system in event of national emergency, accident or natural disaster.
Other municipalities than LV, counties and bi-state interests would probably require public mass transit use of the system in order to justify funding across so many politically funded boundaries.
Our existing passenger rail system had been allowed to degrade into Amtrak as aviation took the lions share of federal funding starting in the 1960's.
That Vegas to Disneyland garbage is an urban MYTH made up by GOP liars and hacks, you dummy. And next time you're stuck in a traffic jam or inconvenienced by the airlines---remember light rail---which IS infrastructure improvement.
Jesus H. Christ, what a dolt.
proof positive that being a rich, privileged little snot with nothing else but time on your hands qualifies you to be a pundit and apparently gives you license to mistake your own narrow world for reality and pretend to know what the "commoners" want.
Eleanor Clift is shrill and annoying, I guess its too much to ask that he get someone with a booming voice that will bellow over the rest of these morons like Jack Germond used to do before he gave up the whole band of idiots.
As for anyone dissing public transport -- lets just wait until fuel climbs up to 5 bucks a gallon and see who looks in touch with the commoner.
http://video.aol.in/video-detail/snl-dana-car...
:D
This is one of my all-time faves. How I miss Dana Carvey.
Thanks, miss_kitty!
Very funny
if the PO isn't strong, because it will give big biz a license to steal a la the Bush years.
You can't fix this level of stupid.
But it would be a heavy infrastructure project.
... and that Las Vegas and LA are major American cities whose residents visit each other several million times per year.
There are actually two kinds of infrastructure projects in the neo-con world. The kind that gets pig people votes and the kind that doesn’t.
"Yes, Mort Zuckerman's hatred for Harry Reid seems to have melted his brain to the point that he is complaining about an infrastructure project in one breath and saying we need more in the next."
I think he was perhaps commenting on what he felt was an unnecessary or ineffective infrastructure project versus something that might create more jobs. I don't think his point was that a legitimate light rail project would not be considered infrastructure. You might not like his politics, but he's definitely not a stupid guy.
That said, $350 million for LV to LA seems wayyy too cheap. Besides, doesn't Amtrak already run that route?
Amtrak is almost useless as commuter rail (in the West) because when it was funded the repugs insisted that freight trains would always have priority over Amtrak. (This is a complete reversal of "normal" train policy.) So you can spend literally hours in Amtrak waiting for freight trains to roll by. Light rail can also have stations downtown where the people are rather than in the heavy industrial section.
If you travel in Europe at all you will be amazed at how quick and easy the trains are. They go almost everywhere. Of course people still bitch about them.
And Greyhound isn't much better. I had a friend stay with me while I was in Vegas a few months back. She determined that hitch-hiking back to Escondido (near San Diego) was the most efficient way to get home.
is correct, I believe you actually have to travel to Needles or Bakersfield, CA to pick up an Amtrak train. Those GOP assholes would love to kill Amtrak and they've tried desperately. They love them some inefficient, heavily polluting transportation.
Light rail between Vegas and SoCal would be wonderful. Vegas is the #1 vacation destination for people in California (I don't get it)and they get here by auto. My husband and I always fantasize about being able to take a trip from Vegas to L.A. on a train with our auto loaded up on a car carrier and then we just drive away from the station to visit friends. We repeat the process to come home. It would save lives, it would save on pollution, it would save on fuel consumption, it would create jobs to build it, run it and staff it - it makes sense.
rail here in the US. The trains would always be full (weekends), and getting around by public transportation or taxis in Vegas is very easy already.
I wish some politicians would have the balls to stand up and argue for a project like this. This IS infrastructure!
I saw this bit on Saturday and am so glad someone else noted the absurdity of it. Good catch!
I am as frustrated as most with his seeming inaction, but have you noticed the sudden anti-Reid ads and appearances this week?
Could it be that they FEAR him?
use the 'F" word in a comment about Reid and Pelosi.
The conservatives have been using the Train from sin city to Disneyland line for a while now. While it has simplicity, it is just stupid. First, the US is way behind China and now Russia in high speed rail. Second, it has been proven over and over again, that a high speed train between cities less than 600 miles apart will do well against airlines. Many people in LA know that driving to Vegas on the weekends is horrendous, and the flights are full and expensive. A high speed train would reduce pollution, air traffic and boost travel to Vegas and help their economy.
We need more high speed trains, especially a real one in the northeast. Too many planes, not enough space.
Sorry, guys, but what Mort Zuckerman is saying makes a lot of sense to me. With so many people losing their jobs and their homes, shouldn't SOME money be going to help them? What Zuckerman says about spending money to repair infrastructure is spot on. That is what FDR did back in the 1930s. Why isn't Obama astute enough to grasp this simple fact?
And as for being senate "majority leader", I can't help but think that both Lyndon Johnson and Everett Dirksen are rolling over in their graves, laughing up a storm. And I am sure that Newt Gingrich is enjoying a yuk or seven as well. Who could blame him?
You have to be kidding, right?
> You have to be kidding, right?
Nope.
light rail is fast and efficient, especially in that corridor. It would put many people to work. Who do you think builds te trains and lays the track?
It would save fuel and reduce pollution.
If you want money for unemployment then tell your GOP congress critter to pass the benefits extension NOW!
> If you want money for unemployment then tell your GOP
> congress critter to pass the benefits extension NOW!
Hate to disappoint you, but I've got a DEMOCRATIC congress critter. And he already has a clue as to what's going on.
> With so many people losing their jobs and their homes, shouldn't SOME money be going to help them?
How many BILLIONS of $$ are going to "people losing their ... homes"?
On repairing infrastructure:
> Why isn't Obama astute enough to grasp this simple fact?
Repairing infrastructure is EXACTLY the point of Obama's plan! If you've paid the slightest bit of attention you know that. He's mentioned it time and time again.
> You're obviousy not a very deep thinker from iowa
You don't even know my name, so how can you possibly have any clue about my thought processes?
For some time, I have wondered if, given how many video clips are given in Windows Media format of Bill O'Reilly and other assorted hosts on Fox News, if this was indeed a closet conservative site. Now, given that attacking a person is an absolute conservative technique, I am convinced it is.
This is my final post on this thread.
How does knowing your name give me an insight on your thought process? I "have a clue" of your thought processes by your clearly not thought out statements! Sure, go ahead and change the subject like a true right wing thinker. I notice you completely avoid the gist of my reply and go straight to twisting the meaning of a comment into an "attack", which it clearly wasn't.
If you can't take the heat, keep your mouth shut!
.
good catch Heather
Zuckerman considers light rail infrastructure as pork.
And BHO spinelessness with any serious decision shows that the products of our ivies are vacant gasbags. Is this all we have to offer in this meltdown. Gasbags on the tube.
Why would anyone waste time on the McLaughlin Group ? When will this clown go away and what does this show offer ? Most of these weekend analysis groups are dinosaurs and feature dinosaurs regularly. Why would I care what Zuckerman or Buchanan or McCain have to say ? This show' viwership has to consist of aging Republicans and as such can't be watched by many.
If this is a train from LA to LV, it is not light rail. It is, however, infrastructure. I believe Reid had suggested a Maglev train at some point, which would have been very expensive.
Amtrak, btw, gets delayed by freight traffic because the railroads are privately owned and Amtrak has to pay to use them. If there is going to be real rail transit in this country, that has to be reversed. Tax policy and corporate 'thriftiness' have caused the rail system to deteriorate or be torn up. It is a worthwhile investment to get it up to at least Bulgarian standards.
Here in Minnesota, we're used to dinosaurs with their heads up their asses like Zuckerman. We have a state that's half urban and half rural and the metros end up strangling in traffic because the state legislature has had a devil of a time passing transportation infrastructure modern cities need.
The Twin Cities is so spread out now that we don't have the funds to maintain all the roads that have been built. We really have to stop the sprawl to control the costs.
How can you seriously call a train from Las Vegas to Disneyland "infrastructure"?
How many people does it help? It's a payoff to a corporate entity.
Infrastructure, at least in my opinion, should help the multitudes of people to get where they need to get.
I'm not a fan of Zuckerman, but I have to agree with him on this.
It's from LOS ANGELES, not Disney.
It'll put 1000s of people to work for years AND reduce pollution.
Multitudes of people do travel from LA to LV or LV to LA every day. Tourism is a valued industry also. Think of all the waiters, housekeepers, low wage earners of all types who'll benefit.
Think of all the tech and higher wage earners. Construction, heavy equip operators, designers, steel mill workers, aluminum workers, fabricators.
Obviously you're not paying attention to the details and thus making very uninformed opinions.
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