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Rachel Maddow with the latest development on the kill-the-gays bill in Uganda. Pastor Rick Warren finally comes out and denounces the bill. As Rachel notes, better late than never and a positive turn given Warren's influence in Uganda. Apparently Warren isn't too happy about Maddow's reporting and claimed that he had been "mischaracterized by the media".

Rachel assumed that meant her since she's the only person in the media that has been covering this story. She invited Warren to come on her show. That I would like to see. As Rachel reports James Inhofe is now trying to distance himself from the bill as well, and Chuck Grassley wouldn't take the time to respond, but his staff told The Rachel Maddow Show that he's never been a member of The Family. Jeff Sharlet said he stands by his reporting and his sources told him that Grassley travelled to Uganda on behalf of The Family back in the 80's.

MADDOW: An update for you now on a story that we‘ve been covering for many more days in a row than I thought we would be covering it. The story involves Rick Warren.

Rick Warren is perhaps the most famous pastor in America today. He was the source of great political controversy earlier this year when President Obama invited him to lead prayer at the inauguration, despite Mr. Warren‘s history of antigay activism, specifically his support for Proposition 8 in California, which revoked existing marriage rights for same sex couples.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICK WARREN, PASTOR: I‘m opposed to having a brother and sister be together and call that marriage. I‘m opposed to older guy marrying a child and calling that a marriage. I‘m opposed to one guy having multiple wives and calling that marriage.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You think those are equivalent to gays getting married?

WARREN: Oh, I do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MADDOW: Oh, I do.

On the issue of Prop 8 specifically, Mr. Warren made the mistake of trying to deny that he‘d ever taken a position on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WARREN: During the whole Proposition 8 thing, I never once went to a meeting, never once issued a statement, never once even gave an endorsement in the two years Prop 8 was going.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MADDOW: No statement. No endorsement.

That ended up being awkward because of the whole “bearing false witness” thing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WARREN: Let me just say this really clearly, we support Proposition 8, and if you believe what the Bible says about marriage, you need to support Proposition 8. So, I urge you to support Proposition 8 and pass that word on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MADDOW: I think that counts as an endorsement. Rick Warren had not only been involved in Proposition 8, he had been involved on tape.

Well, now Rick Warren has been implicated in much worse antigay politics as Uganda—a nation in which he has been intensely involved—is now considering legislation that would imprison and even potentially execute people for the grave crime of being gay.

Uganda is the second nation in Africa that Rick Warren designated as a “purpose-driven” nation. Mr. Warren launched his national “Purpose-Driven Living” program in Uganda last March.

Last night on this program, we spoke to an Anglican priest who has traveled to Uganda to report on the development of the “kill the gays” legislation there. Among the things he brought up with us was just how influential Rick Warren is in that country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAPYA KAOMA, ANGLICAN PRIEST: Rick Warren went to Uganda, you know, in 2008. And he made this saying that homosexuality is not a normal way of life and we have—we aren‘t going to tolerate any of this. And then he goes to say, therefore, it‘s not a human rights issue.

So you have another big person in terms of how Africans look at Pastor Warren. You know, you have to go there, every church I entered, office I entered, I found his book the “Purpose-Driven Life” and people stare at it, it‘s more like a second Bible. So, he has a lot of influence, so when he makes that statement, it carries a lot of weight to the Uganda populace.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MADDOW: Rick Warren has used his influence in Uganda not only to promote his own programs, the purpose-driven nation stuff, but also to get involved in Ugandan religion and politics, flying to Uganda last year to announce he was on the side of the Ugandan ministers who were boycotting the Church of England for being too pro-gay.

Rick Warren also invited a virulently anti-gay pastor from Uganda to come to his own Saddleback Church in California, while that pastor was being promoted by Mr. Warren in the United States, back home in Uganda, that pastor was publicly burning condoms in Jesus‘ name.

Rick Warren‘s involvement in Ugandan affairs or—and his involvement in Ugandan affairs was so extensive that he even lobbied U.S. politicians to steer Uganda toward abstinence-only education rather than condom-based programs which had helped reduce the country‘s rate of HIV infections.

Rick Warren‘s intensive involvement in the politics of Uganda included multiple trips to that country and meetings with Uganda‘s first lady.

Because of all of that, because of his influence in that country and his intensive involvement there, when that country including the pastor Mr. Warren had invited to his church started pushing this outrageous legislation to kill people for being gay, it‘s natural that Rick Warren would be asked his opinion about it.

And about a week and a half ago, Mr. Warren gave his opinion on the subject to “Newsweek.” He said, quote, “It is not my personal calling as a pastor in America to comment or interfere in the political process of other nations.”

Well, now, finally, after a little bit of attention to this subject in this country, Rick Warren has finally decided to come out against the legislation—as if he had been against it all along.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WARREN: The potential law before your parliament is unjust, it‘s extreme, and it‘s unchristian toward homosexuals—requiring death penalty even in some cases. And if I‘m reading the proposed bill correctly, this law would also imprison anyone convicted of homosexual practice. I urge you to speak up. The pastors of Uganda, speak out against this proposed law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MADDOW: For opponents of this proposed law, Rick Warren‘s intervention here, his written statement and his video statement, will be filed under the better-late-than-never category—definitely under better. This will be very good news for people who are opposed to this law given his influence in that nation.

That said, Mr. Warren‘s statement today included the allegation that his role in all this had been somehow mischaracterized by the media, saying that lies have been told about him and this issue in media that have covered it.

As the person who‘s been doing the most media on this subject, at least on TV, as far as I can tell we have not said anything inaccurate about Rick Warren in our reporting. We triple-checked everything that we‘ve said about him today, I don‘t think we‘ve gotten one thing wrong about him.

If he feels differently, Pastor Warren, I would be happy to host you on this program to clarify anything. Unless you know something that we don‘t, I stand by our reporting.

Another American who has been silent on this issue for weeks is also now speaking out to us. This happened late in the day today, Republican Senator James Inhofe of Oklahoma. Mr. Inhofe has made repeated trips to Uganda in recent years, what he has called, quote, “a Jesus thing.”

And after days of silence on this issue, Senator Inhofe has finally told us this tonight, quote, “I was shocked and appalled to learn through media reports of the legislation being considered in Uganda regarding homosexuality. I do not, nor have I ever, supported or condoned the abhorrent legislation being considered in the Ugandan parliament, to suggest otherwise is absolutely and unequivocally false. It is my hope that Uganda will abandon the unjust approach being considered.”

It is unclear whether or not Mr. Inhofe plans to communicate this view to Ugandan authorities. We have asked. We will keep you posted as to whether we receive a response.

One final note on this: Republican Senator Chuck Grassley has also come under fire on this subject because of his alleged ties to the secretive religious organization known as the Family, most famous for operating the C Street house in Washington. The Family has been intensely involved in Ugandan religion and politics for years, and reportedly involved in the origins of the “kill the gays” bill specifically. It was reportedly announced for the first time at a Family sponsored event, the Ugandan prayer breakfast.

Mr. Grassley still hasn‘t spoken out against the bill, but he did through a spokesperson today say that he has never had anything to do with the Family ever.

Senator Grassley is described multiple times as a member of the Family in Jeff Sharlet‘s book-length expose of the group. We contacted Jeff today to get his response to Mr. Grassley denying he‘s ever had anything to do with the Family, Jeff told us that he stands by his reporting in his book. He said that as recently as yesterday, he learned from Family sources that Chuck Grassley traveled to Uganda in the mid-1980s at the request of the Family.

Whether or not Chuck Grassley is a member of the Family or not, we are still very curious as to what the senator thinks about the prospect of putting people to death for being gay. We are still waiting to hear from him on that subject and we live in hope.

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50 Comments
bartfarb's picture

using religion as a means to power.

Johnny2Bad's picture

"I can't keep doing this on my own with these...people."

Plisko's picture

"if you believe what the Bible says about marriage, you need to support Proposition 8."

-Rick Warren-

If you believe what the bible says about gays you should have no problem with the "Death to gays" bill in Uganda. That must be very awkward for these people.

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them." Leviticus 20:13

**update for clarity**
It's a perfect trap really:

How can you be a religious conservative and condemn a law in Uganda that follows the exact words of the bible? These people say we need to follow the bible. And there it is in black and white. . yet they condemn it. . Therefore, by doing this they essentially condemn themselves and their fundimentalism. It sort of puts them exactly where they deserve to be.

That was a good comment

Calm

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

He looks like jerry falwell with a devil's goatee.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

cund_gulag's picture

Kill the Gay's!
Hmmmm... Let see. Jesus was a single guy. He hung out with twelve to thirteen men, at least. The only women near his inner circle were his Mom and Mary Magdanene, a woman described by some as a former prostitute.
The guy sound like an early, sloppy, and bad version of a "metrosexual" at best, at worst, a... a... a...
Oh no, can't go THERE!

If the law is passed, how long will it be before the ones who voted for it are discovered in bed with a live, or dead, young or old male? My over/under is about two fucking hours. AFter passing the law, they'll want to celebrate. Anyone THAT anti-gay is usually gay. Anyone remember Ted Haggard? Ted was the very scourge on drugs and homosexuality, until he was discovered with one hand full of meth and the other hand full of male prostitute. Oooops!
Of course, the law won't apply to the Ugandan's who passed it. No rich *********** will ever be punished. Only the poor ones. And if you're the little Dutch boy, go ahead and put your finger in the dike, but God help your sister if she does the same.

[Edited. We know you meant 'dike' with a 'y,' but we have it in the filter. I FIFY-Sitemonitor]

but the church from the media.

Stop FEEDING THEM.

let me ask you why I'm allowed to write "***********" but not **** (rhymes with pike"? Is it because I threw in the hyphen? Let me see if this works - ********** and *****.
Nope, "preview" allowed **********. Now how about ****?
NO! HAH!!! WTF?!?

[You aren't now. FIFY-Sitemonitor]

fiver's picture

And is it legal in Uganda?


Corruption favors the wealthy.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Tea-bagging at Brokeback Mountain.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

For awhile there I thought I was gonna hear:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=569Gy8BE5P4&fe...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFMDSN4YEh4

(Around 6:15).


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

Swift2's picture

Primitive hoo-ha dressed up as an enlightened attitude. The difference between Falwell and Warren is trivial. He is just another, kinder face for the old bigotry and tribalism. Let's tax 'em.

Shadowgm's picture

... that's the issue. They could be paying a 99% tax rate and I STILL wouldn't want their religious ideology passed off as the foundation for laws.

gladnottobeamerican's picture

is a unique reporter!!!

Watching her show is almost like watching European TV - no bias at all - just a first hand report, thanks a lot!!!!

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

I'd like to see a first hand report on pornography.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

curtilingus's picture

Wouldn't it be better to see something in depth?

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

It's hard to stick a camera between the performers

Unless they start using ultrasound.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

ron's picture
.

John Holmes died.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Jeremy?


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

curtilingus's picture
3p:

At least he got a chance to spread his seed.

"bold" (more like lukewarm) stance on behalf of GLBT Ugandans.

I read your book when I was evangelical. You taught that everyone had a special purpose from God, and a unique life pattern. Well, guess what, mine includes being bisexual. And for the GLBTs of Uganda, it includes being GLBT. Shame on you for contributing to the potential snuffing out of what the Ugandan GLBT community has to offer to Uganda and the world!


"The greatest tyranny is censoring information in order to be better able to control people." - Cristina Saralegui

Annaleigh's picture

*


"The greatest tyranny is censoring information in order to be better able to control people." - Cristina Saralegui

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Drives my eyeballs a little crazy with that close sentence structure.

They were prosecuted by the church because some of the Quietists, believed if they sinned it was God's will, and God's Will be done.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

And thanks, I hadn't heard of them before. Knowing Christianity, I can tell why they were persecuted, unfortunately...


"The greatest tyranny is censoring information in order to be better able to control people." - Cristina Saralegui

... then why do presidents have to be sworn in using a bible?

... and why are preachers and prayer an integral element of the inauguration?

... but most importantly, what was the official excuse for having this POS in the inauguration for this administration?

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

I'd like to see the president swearing Roman style

By grasping his balls.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

miss_kitty's picture

?

Samson-'s picture
:)

nice

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Yep.

Brings whole new meaning to church call and response, "Testify brother!"

And anatomically impossible for the sisters unless they have brothers.


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Would the first woman president have to swear on the Chief Justice's teabags?


Diabolus est Deus Inversus

She would just need to appoint ball washers.

6 minute mark
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAsmDG9SXYA

Although most presidents have used a bible to take the oath of office, the bible is not a requirement to be sworn in as president. A president can choose to be sworn in or affirmed.

Theodore Roosevelt was the only U.S. President sworn in without a bible.

Ansley Wilcox, who owned the Wilcox Mansion where Roosevelt was inaugurated, wrote: "According to my best recollection no Bible was used, but President Roosevelt was sworn in with uplifted hand." (The Presidents and Their Wives)

miss_kitty's picture

They don't. This was covered when the nutcases went doubleplusturbo ballistic over the possibility Obama, who is Christian, might insist upon being sworn in on a *shock and horror* Koran!!! Do you think Holy Joe is sworn into office using a Bible? I think not.

post ;-)

miss_kitty's picture

mkay, but I wasn't the only one. And I feel I'm in fairly decent company there.

;-)

Tyler Durden's picture

My grievances had more to do with religion in general, than the denomination chosen for a specific inauguration.

miss_kitty's picture

I got it after I posted. I just didn't feel like correcting myself. I wanted you to have something to do...

:D

moonsha's picture

More than a few mega-church pastors have already teamed up with powerful conservative groups to cajole and lobby black voters into supporting anti-gay initiatives and the Republican Party. Utilizing the media, these pulpit bullies are spreading their hate doctrine via television, radio and the Internet.

Uganda is being used as a test to see what kind of messaging will work to indoctrinate the majority of the black population to control them while the U.S. foreign policy of pillage and plunder for oil continues to divy up nice contracts with bought off legislative government of Uganda.

The results will be studied by the mega church pastors here in hopes of dividing up the black community and church congregations for political gains by ultra-conservative groups.

ysbaddaden's picture
)O(

Diabolus est Deus Inversus

BigD145's picture

IF Rick Warren had taken a real stand, he'd have gone straight to Uganda and made absolutely certain that no single piece of the bill would get passed.

gump's picture

Really wasn't a big fan of Rachel when she was on Air America. Not quite sure why but just wasn't. But this woman has really grown on me since she's been on MSNBC. She's is an investigative reporter and brings us the stories EVERYONE needs to hear. And she makes a difference. Just look at this story alone. If it wasn't for Rachel no one would have heard about and people like Warren(Scum) Inhofe(Dirtbag) and Grassley(Dickwad) would have remained quiet and the extermination of Ugandan gays could have been underway with the support of conservatives in this country.

Rachel is definately one of best things in journalism this country has.


is intended to be a factual statement

Woody McBreairty's picture

To Plisco: You are obviously small minded & ignorant. You are a user of the Bible to perpetuate your bigotry & hate. You are likely uneducated and live a trailor trash life style.
That being said, if you believe in the Bible for for some things, you have to believe in all of it. That includes murder, incest,human & animal sacrificece, revenge, murder, war, hate, spite, threats, egoism, ad infinitum. If you know the Bible, you will know where to find the passages that condone slavery, killing your children, stoning to death an unfaithful wife and most anyone else who offends you. You are a coward & a fool not to stand up for the personal rights & freedoms of all human beings and I am being kind by responding to your pathetic post because you are not even really worth this minute or two of my time.


Woody McBreairty

Plisko's picture
Uhh

Uhh. . you are kind of jumping to conclusions there Woody. I was pointing out that the religious conservatives are caught between their bible and their PR when it comes to this Uganda issue.

They say how importaint the bible is and how we need to believe every word and there it is in black and white according to the bible "gays must die" in Leviticus 20:13. Even though it says this. . they still feel OK condemning Uganda for passing a law that essentially follows the bible.

Do you see how this would be very awkward and contradictory to religious conservatives? Do you see how it makes them look like a bunch of opportunist hippocrites?

That's what I was saying. . . and for the record. . not all people who read and understand the bible are uneducated trailer trash scum blah blah blah.

oh. . and there is no "C" in my name so your spelling sucks.

Arundel's picture

Smart, informed, she keeps her cool but she's got a fierce sense of justice and accountability when it comes to sick horrors like this, and the truly wicked charlatans and horrible people behind them. I admire her diligence in bringing this to light, with substance and depth. Valiant lady, i wish there were more TV journalists like her.

calgarylady's picture

I second that!

merkin's picture

Rick Warren....

When will his meth day come??

miss_kitty's picture

but it's obvious he's stuffed his gay day in a closet.

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