September 03, 2009 10:00 AM
Phil Gingrey- Great Defender of the Private Insurance Companies-- Trust Them to Regulate Themselves
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Phil Gingrey (R-Healthcare Industry) doesn't think we need any stinking regulation of the insurance industries. Just trust them if they say they're going to make changes. Why do we need any silly laws to make sure they behave? We've got their word they won't keep shafting us. Isn't that good enough?
Of course when pinned down on those statements and asked directly if we can trust the insurance industry to keep their word without any laws in place to make sure they won't keep sticking it to their customers, Gingrey retreats to attacking a "government takeover" of health care rather than answer the question.
Do you need more proof?
republicanism is a mental illness!
What a lying bought and paid for scumbag this gingrey is!
Talk about assinine this guy wouldn't know the truth if it hit him in the face.
What bullshit!
Hell yes lets eliminate all the insurace compaines we would all be better off by at least 30%.
These republicans are sick sick sick people.
But where is the NEW candidates to run against these republican DEMOCRATS calling themselves Blue Dogs / centrists..
The democrat leaders will most likely fund a republican candidate to run against Kucinich... They have certainly censor any actions and bills Kucinich has intruduced or statements he has made..
The same persons in the democrat party which are destroying our policies like the inclusion of a single payer or at least a public option are still being funded and supported by the democrat fund collected from us the very persons they hate..
We might as well know that Emanuel , Obama , blue dogs and centrists have made it war against the progressives and the corporate news media are now dancing to their tune.
If we do not draw a line in the sand now , we might as well join the republicans also...
Just why in the h... are we funding , supporting and voting for these republicans just because they wish to call themselves democrats to run on the democrat ticket..
Our house is burring down and we are throwing GAS on it.. How many times do you have to be kicked in the b.lls and when you bent over get kicked in the a..
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insurance industry would say "we're not going to charge them an arm and a leg." Besides the obvious inappropriateness of that phrase, he uses "We're?" He includes himself in the category of health insurance companies? At last someone admits it.
According to him, people don't want anything to do with the public option? Dems have been hearing about this for the entire break? How could they hear anything with all the wing nuts people like you inspired preventing any real discussion whenever they got a chance.
You want a good bipartisan bill? You LOST the election. Bipartisan that! Why, if as you claim, we have the best health care system in the world, do you think we need anything to change? Consistency--get some.
Then he links the health insurance industry to Big Pharma? Thank you for finally admitting that.
Who turned this blithering idiot loose? Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Why not get rid of all prison staff and unlock the doors. The savings would be huge and the prisoners I'm sure could be trusted to stay in their cells until their sentences are served.
If This Banking criminal disaster has not shown Americans and the world that the Global Corporations can and do not regulate themselves
than Americans are hopeless...
Not only do they "not regulate" themselves but our government creats a credit card in our and our children's name to pay them multi-trillion dollars in welfare checks..
And the private health companies want to say Americans want welfare and social programs..
Why in the h... are we not voting out these blue dogs and centrists republicans calling themselves democrats..
Bet we will never see more democrats like Kennedy elected.
Emanuel is cleaning house of all progressives and their policies..
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is because government creates moral hazard. Corporations behave differently because government has reduced the naturally occurring risk in the kinds of transactions the banks were involved in, therefore they made too many aggressive (to the point of lunacy) bad transactions.
Had the government not had history of bailing this shit out time and time again, these greedy bastards would be losing their money off such hair brained schemes. So the blame for this goes squarely with the government. It incentivized businesses to make bad, risky investments. Capitalism would have punished that shit in the only way greedy bastards understand - they'd lose their f'n money.
Such an amazing display of mental gymnastic ability ... NOT.
Yet another fine example of the psychopathic RethugliKKKlan political posturing.
From Grassley: "Greed is good", and from this mental midget: "Self-regulation". Don't these RethugliKKKlans practically worship Alan Greenspan, who stated that " ... we thought that self-regulation was adequate, that greed was not self-destructive. we were wrong ... "? (okay, I have paraphrased here)
WTF is wrong with these people?
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
-- John F. Kennedy
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Dear Phil Gingrey,
IF you are to be correct...
... The Insurance industry would have already driven lower costs.
But they haven't and history proves you incorrect.
.
Starve the WAR Beast...
... Feed Americans.
exactly what I was thinking. Instead of regulating themselves and being competitive, these fucktards decided to rob people blind! Screw 'em! It's time their gravy train was over... long past time actually!!
Teh repugs have no need for facts!
you fascist piece of shit.
How is one state able to put so many selfish jerks on the national political stage?
Democrats like Emanuel , Obama , Baucus , Nelson , other blue dogs and centrists are supporting them..
Did we not hear the statement from Obama and Emanuel's own mouth...
They stated they were going to move the democrat party to the center...
Well we are pass the center now and it they keep adding move republicans there will be a right wing republican party and a right center republican party which has replaced the democrat party..
We hear nothing coming from the lips of the democrat leaders except there will be no single payer or public option in the health reform..
NO they have been paid well by the health Empire not to rock the boat,, the same as they were by the banking empire..
It is starting to seem as if the republicans and democrats are not fighting over policies and wishes which are beneficial to Americans , but for the gold ,,,, but who will receive the most political donations from the Global Empires...and other benefits..
When democrats recruit and fund republicans to run on the democratic ticket as democrats ,,, we should know they do not give a d... about US..<>.. because the only thing important to them is to be voted back into office for their personal power and wealth...
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MSNBC's version of fair and balanced: give airtime to this walking turd to balance out Schakowsky.
Are jumping on republicans saying they are our problem,,,, But look what the democrats supposedly have... The senate , house and the presidency and we can not pass a health bill with a public option must less a single payer version..
So just what does this tell you about Obama , Emanuel , Blue Dogs , centrists which are controlling our party and policies..
Emanuel has been supporting republicans for over 6 years now...
Do you now see the control these blue dogs and centrist have over our progressive democrats.. Emanuel is recruiting and funding these republican democrats more and more each and every year for the donations we are giving to the DNC...
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to pass single payer. Imagine the decrease in their incomes and campaign contributions if the health insurance industry and Big Pharma went out of business--or at least business as usual.
And I must ask whoever posted about "moving to the center." Was this before or after the election?
Phil Gingrey (R-Healthcare Industry) (very funny, Heather), is one of the people who will be making policy for us when the corporations seal the deal. If if isn't already done.
That's the trouble with dealing with slimy creatures, just as you think you have a grip on one part of them, the other part starts wiggling.
We all know that once big business gives you their word, it's solid gold. If you believe them it might be solid gold in your campaign chest.
Say what you mean. Mean what you say. But don't say it mean.
As a principle in a health care business, let me warn everyone who thinks they have great (private) coverage that you will be surprised when the time comes for them to step up and help (approve and pay).
Most people do not know how much their insurance policies have been reduced in the last 5 years.
You also have to hope that the 25 year old sitting in a cubicle somewhere will approve your care - and I guarantee you that person will NOT be a doctor, nurse, or therapist!
I'm not in that industry and appreciate your take on this. It pisses me off to no end that, as you state, the 25 year old who decides whether someone gets care or not has NO medical background whatsoever... just a target to make showing the denial of care is x number this week. What a travesty! It's fraud and everyone caught up in perpetrating this fraud should be tried and made to serve time if that's the outcome.
If we can not see the direction of Obama , Emanuel and his other advisors are taking the democrat party and this nation ,,,then we are deaf and blind...
Obama is using Bush illegal policies he invented and at the same time illegally stopping any investigation or prosecution of Bush and his administration...
Obama is not the strong leader and supporter of our citizens that I believe he was...
Obama and Emanuel are throwing us under the bus...
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Private insurance companies are no different than the financial instiutions and we all know how the financial institutions ended up. I expect that the private insurance companies did learn a lesson from the financial institution bailouts but its one not in favor of the customer. The lesson: if at all possible deny the customer's claim and hike their premium payments to compensate for any loses.
Right now private insurance companies are only looking at their bottom line. They have no intrest in helping the customer at all unless they absolutely have to. They serve no useful purpose right now to the public with that frame of mind. I am in favor of laws being imposed to change that line of thinking.
Makes about as much sense as letting me "regulate" what I'm willing to pay for complete coverage.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander, eh?
"I know that there are people who do not love their fellow
man, and I hate people like that! " ~ Tom Lehrer (1928 - )
So let me get this straight. The insurance companies who are now making money hand over fist by making people pay for their service and then working as hard as possible to not have to actually provide that service when the time comes, have totally agreed to reform themselves. And they'll totally do that, because we've seen how open they are to making less money. Or, more likely, they'll promise to try to do it but if it seems like it will cut into their profits obviously they'll drop it and say they did the best they could.
But the possibility of a public option, which would force them to compete with someone with lower prices, will make them curl up and die, suddenly uninterested in hustling to hold on to as much money as they can, this time by having to actually provide better service for more money?
Please tell me that after this clip was over this guy got called out on exactly how illogical and unrealistic everything he said was. Honestly, if you are smart enough to have a hard time believing that he believes the insurance companies should willingly reform, surely you will challenge his claims that they "promised to" and "that's a big commitment" by pointing out that "promising too" doesn't mean anything at all, much less any sort of commitment. They "promise to" cover medical costs for people for a living and then have no problem not doing that.
is natural, as is e.coli and listeria. They will "promise" anything just to get the bill they have been promised passed. The one that mandates that every single taxpayer (and their individual children), have to buy coverage from the private insurers. This will be a huge windfall for them. Then, once that is law, try to enforce the oral promise they made to do better. Just you try. What is that saying? An oral contract isn't worth the paper it's written on? It will certainly apply if this travesty comes to pass.
Love, The Banks, The Oil Companies, The Oil Shipping Companies, The Airlines, The Automotive Industry of the USA, The Communications Companies, Energy Suppliers, Wall Street, et alia."
Ok sounds good to me. They promised. I see no reason to short shrift the private owners of our healthcare.
/Thug Asshat
me-oww!
It's the insurance industry that has gotten us to where we are in the first place. And they're making lots of money doing it.
Does anyone with half a clue really think they want to change things?
they love getting free money! and I think they'll hate to give that up when the people demand it.
Well, it worked for Wall Street (dripping sarcasm).
Do these people think we have forgotten?
Do they think they can keep shoveling the same crap?
Or do they have a higher than warranted opinion of human nature?
Either way, they're morons.
If it is related to a higher than warranted view of human nature, I've begun to wonder if this type of attitude about human nature goes back to a warped view of the teachings of Christianity. Redemption of man and all of that crap. "Trust me."
I'm all for it. I mean, what could go wrong? I'm sure they're not like those criminals in the financial sector.
(Before those who don't know me start torching me, I'm being sarcastic.)
have to use a disclaimer now and then.
In Repug world;
everyone owns a gun and crime goes away
there are no abortions and all children are brought up by loving hetro parents
we all take care of each other thus we no longer need Medicare, Medicaid, or Welfare.
everyone has a job and buys insurance if they want to
we have the best healthcare in the world
we are a peace loving nation
the free market solves all problems
the insurance, oil, banking, and drug industries can be trusted to police themselves
on and on, on and on.....
everyone on the planet is American, white and protestant....
This douche bag is the epitomy of "assinine".
What an ass wipe. I can smell the corporate insurance company dripping off his every word from where I sit. What a piece of shit.
It's brain dead, sold-my-soul-to-the-devil/corporations, disgusting wind bags like this that need to be tossed out of Washington on their air filled butts. What a dumb, arrogant, totally ignorant and deceptive piece of shit.
GA, what the f*ck are you thinking of when you send shit like this to represent YOU??
How do you really feel about this guy? Don't hold back any next time Hulk. :-)
This dude's assi ten.
Did you hear him say, "We're" when he was talking about the insurance industry? What does that confirm for anyone paying attention?
Anti-reform guy punches pro-reform guy, pro reform guy in turn bites anti-reform guy's finger off. Anti-reform guy goes to hospital to have finger reattached.....paid for by medicare!!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/03/fing...
Hospital should have given anti-reform guy the finger....his own! Back. Don't look to the guvment to pay to reattach that finger! Pay for it yourself or go to your insurance company and if they deny your claim and you can't afford to have it reattached, make do with the other 9 fingers!
I wish Reich was given more time to respond to that Confederate, money grubbing prick. Reich would have mopped the floor with him.
I thought it took two to debate.
question be answered, thus running out the time? Why didn't he let Reich speak?
Self regulation is no substitute for govt regulation.
...one more time, I'm going to puke. Do these guys actually believe the shit they spout?
if there's a buck in it for them!
you know the deal sarcasim and talking in absolutes for his followers. many of us talk in nuance. they can't stand that.
understand what he is saying?"
After all, the financial and investment institutions did so well with limited regulation. "These insurance companies have the nation's interest at heart," said Gingrey, with his fingers crossed and his nose suddenly growing at a furious pace.
why the concern? the health care insurance does NOT want competition. it's that simple. their "free market" chatter is bullshxt. their strategy is get rid of competition that way people will have no choice but to pay. all the other developing/emerging countries are going to universal health care model this is the last area to get as much profit as possible. some say we are subsidizing other countries that have competitive bidding for PHarma prices. they don't want to give this up as other countries are changing for their "collective" good.
It means free the market from any oversight by anyone. Let Wall Street do whatever it pleases, and then keep the money it makes. If it loses money, then they demand socialism in the form of bail-outs from the government/taxpayers. It's not like they are getting their tax money back, because they hardly pay any taxes. See how simple it is?
Gingrey's just another another Republican Chickenhawk that talks a bad game, but when it came time to serve in Vietnam or even serve in the military he was supposedly in Med School. His bio doesn't say what years he was in Med School, or even when he graduated! I wonder why?
I believe he's another in that long line of Repubs that are so far back in the closet,that he doesn't know if he's suppose to stand or squat!
one. If he does, it was probably from the Guam Medical School and Chicken Plucking Institute.
looked like a wimp. How come the repug almost always have the control of the mic in these interviews? It is always a loud mouthed repucke against a timid, comprehensive and polite democrat. If the public option is loosing support, it is because dems let the rethugs speak as much as they want no matter how foolish their arguments are.
over the segment, running out the time. Like he didn't want or couldn't allow Reich to speak.
...Gingrey is indeed a slime-ball SOB of the first order. He quit being a gynecologist when he realized he could make more money taking money from his former industry members than from his patients, and he's damn for sure not gonna allow any bill to pass - see that's why he decided to run, he wanted to be in a position to protect the income stream for his former, future and friends', practices - that would threaten that income.
Sorry, but Reich was the wrong guy to take on Gingrey. He's just too meek when it comes to confrontation. What you needed is somebody like Congressman Weiner - it's about time that these 'colleagues' take on each other - including calling a prick a prick. Somebody that would spit in the guys face and report how much money he's on the take from the health-care industry. By the way, Gingrey used to have a long, around the corner, mustache that made him look like Emiliano Zapata - or the Frito Bandito. His 'media advisers' suggested that he would come across better if he did away with the womb broom.
Finally, I was born, raised and live in Georgia...I'm afraid that we're a lost cause when it comes to that 'euphamistic' term 'Progressive' or even this proud LIBERAL. Gingrey is just one more of the assholes that populate the Congress from down here. Somebody needs to put us out of our misery. Maybe the country could 'vote us off the island' or something. Just let me get my kids and grandkids out beforehand.
sentence? Present company excluded.
He says he will veto anything that comes to his desk with a public option. That's rich! Your signature, much like your vote is not necessary to pass the public option dickhead.
The best line was that if a public option passed, it would be the end for Blue and Eatna. If they are so fantastic and everyone loves them so much that they are fighting against the PO like you say, why would they fail? Why would anyone sign up for the PO?
how about you? Haven't they sucked enough life and money out of this country? He also said PI will lead to single payer? I certainly hope that if we get stuck with the PI now, it will lead to single payer. But it won't, thus we want single payer now. I cannot fathom why these people are even allowed into the conversation about health care if this whole thing is not one big scam.
nothings ever gonna happen if the American people don't speak. The population can get together to watch stupid shows like Jon@Kate or Fox News we can get what we want and really need out of Health Care!
You would certainly not be castigated at this time to be fish-eyed and trench-mouthed about the stinking mire of the upcoming healthcare reform battle, but reflection on what got us to this vomitus projecting conjunction is what is largely valued and needed at this time. What got us into this slippery Mucinex-related morass, ultimately, is the educational system, which now prepares students for the job market (Would you like to supersize that?) instead of offering a general education, kind of like adding more fiber to your mental capacity. Pinheads scream about the menace of “liberal education”, but it is in fact the failure of assuring a liberal education that has created this maddening situation, where educated people cannot even debate the pros or cons of the issues at hand due to the lack of independent and critical thinking processes unacknowledged by the simpletons our MSM seem to delight in beaming into our homes at night. Behold the spectacle! So called conservative politicians, those festering gobs, the pork rinds of our communal food for thought, are willing to exploit these misguided fools for their own munificence, despite fish-lip service to family values, and worker ants and their families, along with this rabble of idiots, are expected to subordinate their lives to the needs of their manipulators, be it some panty-sniffing subnormal at the RNC or that insurance industry fat pig loving every minute of it. Material success is the crux of existence, rather than goals and Yahtzee bonus points such as parenting, teaching, and serving the community, which are considered worthless and their practitioners the dimmest of rubes. Those elites with the angry means and real stopping power can succeed while all those creatures lacking are abandoned by the freeway or worse. The cause: The anomie cultivated by the American Dream and, since the prominence is on the competence of the market economy, political opportunism and crime are often seen as the most foxy strategy for making obscene and pointless material gains. The Dream also embodies the use of material success to measure one's self-worth.
Haven't we been doing that since the birth of Reaganomics? Where has this guy been for the last 30 years or so?
I think maybe these Repugs are right about not having a "government takeover"......that would be when I hear folks like Gingrey and realize that he is one of the smug, ugly, small-minded CRETINS running our government.!!!!
I just got a letter in the mail from Aetna informing me about exactly what this fool was talking about - how well they're 'policing' themselves and competing and all. As an unemployed person, I had to get an individual policy, which I've had since 2003, and I felt lucky to get one.
This past year, my monthly premium was $807; the letter that came today says, beginning in October the premium will be $969 a month!! And, I'm freakin' healthy!!!
I'll start looking for a new policy - but I doubt I'll be able to find anyone willing to 'compete' for my business as I'm 61 years old. If I can't find one that costs less, guess I'll just be without insurance.....unless the public option or single payer should miraculously get passed.
I've been emailing and calling my Rep and Sens - I get form letters
telling me how hard they're working for the American people - bull crap!
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
...was lost when he said "I believe we have the best health care system in the world."
To paraphrase Senator Frank...I don't know on which planet he spends most of his time, but on MY planet, 37th out of 40 does NOT qualify as "the best"!
If the insurance industry was seriously considering reforming their SOP, wouldn't they begin with eliminating HUGE salaries? Some insurance CEOs took home less compensation in 2008 than in 2007, but some got increases.
In 2007, Aetna CEO, Ronald A. Williams took home $23,045,834. Aware of the growing trend towards insurance reform, in 2008 Williams took home $24,300,112.
Health Net CEO, Jay M. Gellert: $3,686,230 in 2007 and $4,425,355 in 2008. (above link)
So much for 'self-regulation'.
I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and to the republic which it established, one nation from many peoples, promising liberty and justice for all
If this Fascist Nazi repuke Socialist Corporatist believes so much in what he says WHY is he and the INDUSRTY so AFRAID of the COMPETITION. I do have some more RAZORS to pass out to this COWARD and will cheer him on as he SLITS his WRIST, I will even make sure he does it the right way.
phil gingrey? the same phil gringrey that wanted the govt to interfere with terri schiavo?
It must be mentioned that Phil Gingrey is one of the biggest morans (spelled that way on purpose) to ever serve in Congress. I could care less that he's a doctor. He like other repug Congressmen from Georgia is an idiot. I hope Robert Reich got to ask the good doctor haven't the insurance companies already self regulated 47 million people out of coverage?
... that those politicians opposed to single-pay or public/government option see where their money is coming from.
I vow that any politician in any of my districts, who votes against the afore mentioned options will not receive my vote in any upcoming elections. Money may come, but votes will not, and in the end, that's what counts.
My promises are
as good asbetter than gold.If you need funds to pay for essentials, you have a revenue problem
If you need funds to pay for frivolity, you have a spending problem
Makes him look like the doof he truly is.
Good old doofus Phil...echoing what was promised us by the Republicans and the insurance companies back in 1993.....
Yet another reason why republicans should never be trusted with power.
He reminds me of Elmer Gantry.
'Cos corporate self-regulation ALWAYS works!
(rolls eyes)
...health care system in the world is too stupid to walk upright.
Gingrey is living proof (as was Bill Frist before him) that people who should have been bounty hunters and sewage workers (my apologies to all the reasonable, responsible sewage workers out there) can somehow make it through medical school.
Guys like them should always have MBAs in addition to their medical credentials, because to them medicine is a business and people are widgets.
Something like 80% support some kind of healthcare reform because they know there is a problem, including that it's too expensive. But then most of that 80% apparently have limited brain cells when it comes to considering the solutions because most have rejected all proposals thus far.
So today's healthcare is a problem (i.e. too expensive and/or not readily available) according to most people. But then a significant minority (or a scant majority) simultaneously do not want the government involved in a solution either through targeted regulation at the industry, or a public option.
Our problem appears to not be merely lobbyists for the industry, but that we have a ton of morons in this country. That the lobbyists have mobilized Teh Stoopids is not nearly as much of a problem as is the fat fucking retards that make up the "citizenry". Jeezusss.
Isn't the health insurance industry violating anti-trust regulation when they charge however high they want as well as denying/discriminating pre-existing conditions??
Gingrey is such a moron. If he doesn't like government-run health care, why doesn't he go off it and opt for private insurance himself while scaling back on his pay? In fact, why don't all politicians that don't favor single-payer health care opt out from it, scale back their pays, and go for private insurance, where they may be denied coverage - Bill Maher did mention that "'stupid' is a pre-existing condition," and I know another blogger on C & L mentioned that "Republicanism is a mental illness" - not to mention the hypocrisy thereof.
America hardly has good health care since it is ranked around 37th or so according to the World Health Organization, and what was seen in "Sicko." Granted the medical technology is there, but it's not so available. Do Republicans like Gringley firmly believe that the current American health care system really is better than Canada, Europe, Japan, and any other industrialized nation??
divided up the country and assumed "territories" for themselves so they do not have to compete with each other. Add RICO to your anti-trust point.
in some regions in the country, the insurance companies should be treated as monopolies. but even anti-trust law is pretty forgiving of oligopolies which describes the vast majority of the country. it is one of the most highly regulated industries and yet it still sucks. and this is because we have retarded regulation, written by industry lobbyists and passed by know nothing, crooked, bought and paid for politicians.
until we get control of our own government again (it's been a lengthy period of decay), we aren't really going to fix anything.
...All the more reason why we need to hold politicians' - and the teabaggers' - feet to the fire in order to demand meaningful change in getting what WE the people want, and not what they themselves want politically. We not only have to be assertive about this, but aggressively progressive as well in putting the pressure on politicians who don't listen to us right the first time when we send letters, phone calls, etc. demanding change for the better welfare of our nation.
BTW, I'm not a big fan of being aggressive, since I usually prefer assertion, however, there has never been a greater need to push for aggressively progressive causes from corporations and special interests that suck the money out of us like "vampire-pigs".
the rot and stench is so bad it's not correctable through mere assertion or aggression. it would take peaceful revolution to replace a majority of congress. the people who are in Congress are the problem. no matter how assertive or aggressive they will not do our bidding. they need to be replaced.
and in my view, one important way to get to that day, would be a constitutional amendment: Only citizens can make campaign contributions, with a maximum amount of $100 per citizen per candidate.
Currently corporations have the right to free speech, and campaign donations are considered speech. This travesty takes representation away from the people two-fold: first politicians are beholden to industry and their lobbyists, and second they are compelled to spend time away from lawmaking and listening to constituents, by having to go on the campaign finance trail. This part of the political process needs to be stripped away.
Lobbyists and PACs can still exist. But they would not be able to make any contribution to a candidate's campaign for office. No Congress will make this law on their own, it would have to be done against their will, against the will of industry, and against the will of the courts who have ruled on a bullshit corporate right to directly participate in the political process in a way regular citizens cannot.
Given how much de-regulation the health insurance company has had over these past 8+ years, Teddy Roosevelt would likely turn in his grave since he established anti-trust laws more than 100 years ago. Isn't de-regulation a violation of anti-trust laws to begin with?
...As for Nixon handing over America's health care to private insurers in 1971, that may be one thing he could be laughing his ass off in his grave, besides feeling self-pity for a progressive silent majority, and Bush and Cheney getting away with so much defiling of the US Constitution by lying in order to wage war in Iraq, authorizing torture, spying on American citizens without a warrent, etc.
If I remember correctly last year, fmr. AG Makasy mentioned that "just because something is a crime doesn't make it illegal." - So, if it is de-regulated, then it is perfectly legal (regardless of morality)??
were anti-fraud and anti-trust rules for the health care industry. it is still one of the most regulated industries in America and yet it still sucks. So just like the drug war, and the fact gun laws don't prevent criminals from doing stupid shit, having a highly regulated industry doesn't equate to a well functioning industry that is fair for all.
Health care is in the national interest, and if Republitards were honest and serious about their pro-free market claims, they would consider federal law preempting all state and local laws pertaining to health insurance companies, including their licensing rules and fees. They would stop allowing the regional conglomeration of these insurance companies. All of this would instantly get us more competition than we've seen in at least two decades.
And de-regulation is not inherently a violation of anti-trust unless it's being used to exempt companies from anti-competitive practices. But I would not call that de-regulation, I would call that bad regulation or bad law. If there were no such exemptions on the books to begin with, anti-trust (anti-competition) law would be applicable.
This reminds me how lax the SEC has been over the past 8+ years as Wall Street lived large under virtually no regulation or very bad regulation from exposing bubbles and a house of cards.
that the resolution prescribed by capitalism is by far the vastly more effective incentive for these companies to not be so goddamn greedy? And that resolution is, if you make bad investments, and you overleverage yourself, you lose your f'n money. Lose, do not pass go, do not get paid $200.
NO, instead what government has done, against our collective will, is to prop up these companies when they did wrong. And that was done through both regulation (by the Fed) and by law (from Congress).
These bailouts have created moral hazard. That is, these companies act differently than the risks have been unnaturally (per capitalism) altered by government.
Perhaps a less damaging resolution to the problem, that can include government, would have been to create new good banks with the good assets in order to keep the general economy and capital markets functioning, while leaving the old company with the bad assets. That is, fuck the shareholder as the dumbass mofo's they were for running their company so poorly, and likely fuck the bondholders (who might luck out in 10 years and get paid 50-70 cents on the dollar). LET THOSE assholes wait a decade or however long it will take to figure out how their for shit investments fared, rather than the rest of us bailing them out.
Investment and capitalism involve risks. The risk you'll lose you're f'n money if you don't pay attention. Change that equation and now you create massive greed whereby they expect all the upside and none (or reduced) downside.
are the ones who are accepting money from the corporations. They will not change anything that goes against their own interests and those of their corporate owners. The people have a Constitutional right to dissemble a government that no longer represents their interests. If you have not done so, read the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. You'll see it all there. Also know this: There is a case about to be heard by the US Supreme Court that seeks to expand the ability of corporations to pay for political influence. This current version of the government is so corrupt, it cannot be healed. I'll be back with the citation of the SCOTUS case in a minute or two.
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2009/06/scotu...
try again please
ok now it's fixed. disregard.
Contrary to Grampy McSame claiming to be "the original maverick," true, real mavericks have the ability to say "no" to contributions by corporations like Dennis Kucinich, Ron Paul, and any Democrat or Republican who truly upholds the US Constitution, as opposed to uber-capitalism (and uber-socialism).
government. But they are so terribly outnumbered, that they have no real power, except to inspire. It's very sad.
Unfortunately, idiocracy almost always trumps a truly free and educated society.
Proper education should be mandatory for all children. They must be required to actually learn things, and not be passed just to get rid of them. Even high school diplomas should be earned. When undereducated people are teaching school, there is little hope that students will get the education they deserve. This is the result of corporate influence, too. Check out your local school boards, and see how many people on them have corporate connections. Remember that even corporations need toilet cleaners. They don't want everyone to be properly educated, as then they wouldn't be able to keep the control they have now. This has been building up for years and years--decades and decades, actually. "East coast intellectual elite" is supposed to be an insult, and is to many ignorant and undereducated people. What most people lack is the ability to think critically.
Relatively few people think in-depth or have in-depth knowledge.
A lot of the issues of liberty, property rights, logic, refusing and accepting a premise and asking the right questions, how to think critically, is acquired through the teaching of philosophy. How to think, rather than what to think.
12 years of school to learn so f'n little? It's insulting. But it makes good little worker bees who do what they're told, don't think much, don't question authority, and are good consumers who buy lots of cheap crap they don't really need.
In my experience, critical thinking is generally not taught until junior year in college. It should be taught from Day 1. The "dumbing" down of America has been a major success.
With failing schools and education these days, there should be a reduction in distractions with bullying and especially corporations coming into the curriculum teaching such misinformation - much like in that "Simpsons" episode where the Periodic Table of Elements was replaced by an Oscar Meyer Table of Elements including "Bolognium".
Very funny. Why do you think there is so much bullying? Just because they can? The meanness gets to me. Why do people want to act that way?
they want attention and that kids can be so cruel.
instinctive? It's like the way the town hall agitators are acting. Did you notice that Gingrey didn't answer the question he was asked, but just listed Luntz talking points? That is such a Karl Rove move. Their tactics are becoming so common and well known, that they seem to be doing parodies of themselves. Time for some new writers.
The uneducated masses in this country must somehow learn to get over the phobia that either a single-payer plan or public option is not a bad thing at all, and is not really socialism. Besides, Bill Maher said that Obama is not even a liberal - let alone a progressive.
were so relieved that he wasn't Bush. We thought, incorrectly I think, that because he is a black man he would be more sympathetic to the needs of common people and not "the powers that be." What he has clarified for us is that "the powers that be" are corporations. That point got driven home, and we should thank him for that revelation, even if it was unintentional on his part.
"What's the Matter with Kansas?" by Thomas Frank. It's about why people do things that are against their own interests. Why would anyone not want single payer, unless they benefited directly as a corporate officer or stockholder in a private insurance company? Yet those town hall wing nuts and agitators, like the guy who had his finger bitten off, are against even the watered down public option. The guy who got bitten had Medicare, which is government insurance--a form of single payer. Duh! Why doesn't he know this? Why doesn't he get the contradiction?
doesn't want a "government-run medicare."
What's also sad is that ignorant heckler screaming at an individual in a wheelchair to "ask the question (already)!" as she was telling her story in a NJ townhall mtg.
It would be prudent if people would get over the fear that either single-payer or a public option is a bad thing.
But they are uneducated so that isn't going to happen.
Second, likewise liberals and progressives need to get over the idea that the ONLY way to improve things is either a public option or single-payer plan. That is a detail, it is not a solution. The Netherlands has universal health care that is privately operated (and rather intelligently regulated in favor of the beneficiaries of health care) and there are hybrid approaches possible too.
But we are not going to get ANYTHING good from this Congress. And the reason why, that everyone is totally ignoring, the big white elephant in the room, is that we've lost control of our government.
Corporations and uneducated people combined are the defacto majority with representation in Congress. There is a reason why the founders were bothered by pure democracy - while we can rightfully be critical of their criteria for who can vote and not vote - it was predicated on the intent that people with something to lose would not vote for morons. So now we allow any citizen over 18 to vote and we have a Congress rather representative of the country - mostly morons.
How to fix this is not exactly clear. But until we get control of our government we aren't going to get smarter and we aren't going to fix the big problems causing the country to rot from within (literally - have you seen bridges and the electrical grid problems? Scary.)
Would it therefore be a patriotic obligation to (attempt to) make citizen arrests on these corporations and corrupt politicians in order to help bring back accountability and real progress to be made? Don't we deserve our (most of) our money back when we overpay for high insurance premiums?...The constitution does state that the government is obligated to look after the welfare of its people before themselves. So, there may need to be a LOT more accountability made when it comes to politicians who set themselves politically ahead of the American public.
because they MAKE the laws. The Constitution does not say exactly what you think it does. Read it and, as one of my professors used to make us do, parse it. Break each sentence down so its intended meaning is crystal clear to you. And, we are no longer a democracy. We are an oligarchy. Check it out. Your are on the right track, but it has gone beyond what you are talking about. Also, you cannot arrest a corporation because while they have the rights of a person, they do not have the same responsibilities. They only are required to make a profit for their shareholders. Nothing else.
There really is a HUGE discrepancy between doing what is legal and doing what is morally right. My uncle is a lawyer and what he learned in law school was that while A, B, C, and D are illegal, E, F, G, and H are not recognized under the law.
perhaps that is the point. Ponder this: If something is not recognized under the law, if E is not recognized under the law, can it still be illegal? If you say "yes," how can it be anything in the eyes of the law, if the law does not recognize it? If the law does not recognize it, it cannot have a legal existence? But clearly, if it is "something," then it exists whether the law recognizes it or not. Therefore, it cannot be illegal. This is what is know as "legalese." If you cannot win with facts, baffle them with bullshit.
funded? Or both? Single payer in this country would have been privately operated and publicly funded. That it would have been run by the government is one of the GOP lies. A Luntz talking point.
geezer and front lawn protector.
The typical "stay off my lawn" geezer flailing his cane (or fist).
bathrobe, holding the morning edition along with his cane, and wearing slip-on house slippers.
Also, if politicians are accepting campaign contributions from corporations (industry), then why keep up the pretense that they are concerned about what the people think and care about. To spend time soliciting money from people you do not honestly represent is a form of fraud. Right? One last thing, there is no such thing as a peaceful revolution. It is a contradiction in terms and an old Hippie pipe dream. I am not saying it has to be physically violent, but if you are not prepared to go all the way, then you lose before you start.
It is utterly impossible to reason with such stupid ideologues who think one way or the other, and that's it. That's why stupidity is a bottomless pit.
Knowledge is not intelligence. I really like this concept.
I used to have a tutor when I was in college mention to me that there really is a difference between knowledge and intelligence. With the word "intelligence" in mind, it should come at no surprise that the CIA gets so much intelligence wrong most of the time. Thus, knowledge and education are power!
To use the knowledge you gain from education. Kind of a sequence.
It's all about applying and reiterating educated experience.
person is willing to learn. Judge Judy says, "Beauty fades, but dumb is forever." I wonder what she thinks about aggressive and stupid? We're seeing a lot of those two character defects lately, aren't we?
Although I don't really know what MY IQ is, I am certainly willing and eager to learn.
Now, if only those town hall hecklers thought more before they spoke out boorishly.
bias in them. Don't worry about what your IQ is. Just keep being curious and keep thinking. It seems to me that thinking hurts some people. Gives them headaches. Or they're just too damn lazy and selfish to think about anything unless it's about themselves.
I always try questioning almost everyone and everything. Einstein said, "the most important thing in life is to never stop questioning."
That guy on the left simply SCREAMS pomposity.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
I found this on the Atlanta Journal Constitution site as part of the thread discussing Representative Gingrey’s MSNBC appearance --
Kudos to the contributor. It underscores for me what hypocritical contortions Republicans and their comrades in arms on the Democratic side, the DLC crowd and the corporate crotch sniffing Blue Dogs, will gladly endure to prove to their masters that they will remain ever faithful in their worship of PROFIT!
Since profit most likely has to be eliminated from American health care, there should be some way to cap-and-trade the huge profits made in the health insurance industry to the point it can pay for either a single-payer or public option, perhaps thru some kind of anti-trust lawsuit by the United States.
At least could we get much of the money back that we pay for health care??...I know I've been waiting on a reimbursement/reprocessing check by Aetna to come in the mail for months now, even 3 years after my plan expired!
to exist. If private corporations have no way of making a profit, they have no legal reason or purpose. That would make them illegal. By definition, a public option, public meaning government, cannot be paid for by private insurance companies. Single payer actually means tax payer funded. Ask your uncle what anti-trust suits entail. It was fun. Goodnight.
So, Phil Gingrey (R-Healthcare Industry) thinks that the Public Option is a lead in to wiping out the private Health care industry. It hasn't wiped out private health insurance in Canada.
Forever from this day, never allow Gingrey to speak words of "Competition" again!!
Gingrey should have his health care provided from the public revoked.
matter of fact, a bill should be proposed that if real health care reform with a strong public option is not enacted. All of congress should have their health care revoked.
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