PBS Newshour: Dick Armey vs Richard Kirsch on Health Care Reform
Here's a little preview of the B.S. we can expect FreedomWorks' Dick Armey to be spouting on Meet the Press this weekend. He faced off against Health Care for America Now's Richard Kirsch on The PBS Newshour Thursday night. Armey uses people buying into his disinformation campaign as proof that there must be something wrong with the health care bills making their way through Congress. I agree there are problems, but for the opposite reason Dick Armey does, and somehow pursuit of the truth doesn't look like it's at the top of his organization's agenda. Protecting the insurance and health care industries' profits are.
JUDY WOODRUFF: As the fight over reforming health care spreads from here in Washington, D.C., across the rest of the nation, we hear now from advocates on both sides of the issue.
Former U.S. House Majority Leader Dick Armey is chair of FreedomWorks, a conservative group that has rallied protestors at health care town hall meetings.
And Richard Kirsch is the national campaign manager of Health Care for America Now, a liberal group which has urged its supporters to turn out at the meetings.
Thank you both for being here. We thank you for being part of this discussion.
And, Dick Armey, I'm going to come straight to you on the basics. You believe that there should be some form of reform of health care, health insurance, but a more limited form than what the president favors.
DICK ARMEY, FreedomWorks: Yes, I do. And we go back to things I've argued for, tort reform is -- estimates now as much as $100 billion of just sheer abject waste, which, by the way, is a hardship...
JUDY WOODRUFF: Tort reform, for those people who don't know the legal term, means...
DICK ARMEY: Well, lawyers suing doctors and that which causes doctors to order up extra procedures on behalf of patients that are not needed medically, but they need them in case they end up in a courtroom.
I watch this process. The thing that breaks your heart about that is, especially with older folks, to be subjected to extra procedures that are not medically necessary is a very difficult burden for them to carry when they're already oftentimes quite fragile and the procedures themselves can be quite a stressful experience for them.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So tort reform would be an important change for the system?
DICK ARMEY: That would be a good place to start.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Would that be enough, Richard Kirsch?
RICHARD KIRSCH, Health Care for America Now: That's not the problem Americans face, Judy. Basically, what Americans face is a problem of they don't have a guarantee of good health care they can afford.
Three out of five of the personal bankruptcies in this country are because of medical costs, and most of those people have insurance, but the insurance isn't there when they need it, because if they get seriously ill, it stops paying.
Did you know that premiums in the last decade have gone up four times as fast as wages? People can't afford to get health coverage.
And so we have this tremendous sense of insecurity, and what people need is a guarantee of good, affordable coverage at work or, if they don't -- if they're not at work, to have that coverage there, too. And what we're talking about is basically saying to America: You have good coverage that you can afford.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And you're saying provide that how?
RICHARD KIRSCH: Provide that very simply. What the reforms that we're looking at do two things. First of all, they say, if you're at work, your employer is going to continue to provide coverage at work, or -- and the coverage is going to be good, because there are going to have to be a specified set of good benefits, and if you don't have coverage at work, you're going to go into a new health insurance marketplace where you're going to have a guaranteed choice of coverage that's affordable based on what you earn. It's very simple.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Why isn't that a system that would work?
DICK ARMEY: Well, the biggest problem that they have with this -- this sounds great. I mean, I have to tell you, you're warming my heart.
RICHARD KIRSCH: It is great.
DICK ARMEY: But the fact of the matter is there is a large and growing number of Americans who are actually reading the bills that have come through the House and they just don't believe that. They see this as a hostile government takeover of all health care, where they will be forced into a government-run program, and their health care lives will be managed by the government, just as today's the case in Medicare.
If you're over 65 years old in America today, you have no choice but to be in Medicare. Even if you want out of Medicare, you have to forfeit your Social Security to get out of it. Even if you're a Christian Scientist, you have to give up your Social Security. That's pretty heavy-handed, and people fear that.
JUDY WOODRUFF: What about this charge?
RICHARD KIRSCH: Well, I mean, I think what Dick Armey just said is absolutely to the point. He doesn't think Medicare should exist. Basically, Medicare is the system that provides a guarantee of good coverage for seniors in this country.
It is, in fact, what is meant -- your old age means you don't have to worry about not getting the health care you need. That's the same thing we need to do for everybody in this country, but we need to do it in a system that provides choices between regulated private insurance or public insurance. And the point is, we need that guarantee for people to have affordable health coverage.
DICK ARMEY: Let me just be clear about something. I have no problem with Medicare. I was talking to my minister just last night about it. If you want to voluntarily be a part of it, bless your heart, I'm proud for you. I want you to have it.
But I do have a problem is forcing people in it and be given very, very punitive government sanctions against anybody who would say, "I don't want to be in that program."
JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, let's address...
DICK ARMEY: You should have a right to say no to the government and say, "I don't want to be a ward of the state."
JUDY WOODRUFF: What about this very point? He's saying that, under the plan or the plans that are moving through Congress, people would be forced into government health care, either Medicare or some other...
RICHARD KIRSCH: First of all, that's totally untrue. Under the plans that are being introduced and passed by so far three committees in the House and one in the Senate, people at work would keep their coverage at work, but the coverage would change in the following ways.
Your employer's coverage would have to meet certain minimum standards, so the benefits would have to be good, and the employer would have to pay for a decent amount of your coverage. So that's private insurance at work.
And if you then don't get private insurance at work, what you would do is go into a new health care marketplace where you would choose from multiple private insurance plans, not government plans, private insurance plans, and one new public insurance plan.
That's not a government takeover of anything. It is government regulation so we're sure that health insurance works for you.
JUDY WOODRUFF: What's wrong with that...
DICK ARMEY: There's nothing wrong with his story as he tells it. But the fact of the matter is, even the Congressional Budget Office says 100,000 -- or 100 million Americans will lose their -- their...
RICHARD KIRSCH: That's not what they say.
DICK ARMEY: ... their employer-provided insurance. The Congressional Budget Office...
RICHARD KIRSCH: That's not what they say.
DICK ARMEY: This is not quarreling with me.
RICHARD KIRSCH: The Congressional Budget Office actually did an analysis of the House bill. And what it said is, under their bill, the number of people who will be -- not lose their private insurance. The number of people, mostly uninsured people now who will go into the public plan will be 9 million. That's the number in the analysis of the House bill.
DICK ARMEY: Well...
RICHARD KIRSCH: That's the facts. That's what it says.
DICK ARMEY: Well, so we have a difference of information here. But I have to tell you, if you take a look at the unrest that you see brewing in America today, it's precisely because the American citizenry at large does not believe what the government and agents of the government are telling them.
you're a dick!!!!!!!!
Some stuff you can't make up!
Obama's health reform is for the health giants..
Makes every American they can squeeze a penny out of to buy into the private rip off.
Gives the health insurance guarantee that we can not buy drugs from Canada or other counties;
Also stops Medicare from bargaining for lower prices of drugs..
Cut tests for more profit they see fit to and tell the doctors they can not prescript then for patients.
So more people , less service and tests , and cheaper drugs at higher prices and anyone HAS to join and give them their money..
The good old corporate democrat party with Obama and Emanuel in charge has arrived on the scene..
THIS??? is the CHANGE??? they have been promising.. that is the same old same old BS plus more gravy for corporations and with a transparent government that is not transparent but more deceptive.
And a government Of the Corporations , By the corporations and For the corporations..This is the change that is a coming Obama , Emanuel and the democrats say ,,, like it or not..
None
[ http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0809/261... ]
Study the symptoms not the virus...
They had ample opp to reform healthcare and they didn't give even the tiniest of turds about it then. Now they have all the answers. Dicks, all of them.
It look like Obama is going to sell us out in favor of big insurance. We get nothing while insurance companies get everything. Once again the Republicans want to screw us and the Democrats who are in power going along with their plan.
I already sent an e-mail to Obama telling him that if he sides against 70% of America this time what will happen when he needs us to get relected.
I am so sick if being screwed by these two parties. Until we get rid of both of them and start over then we can no longer claim the "greatest country in the world". We have not been great in a long time, the repugs brought us down and the now dems are keeping us there.
Nobody ever got well betting against Obama. I'll take him at his word. I haven't seen anything as yet that would lead me to think he's sold out. It is a process and takes time. He said it would be difficult.
... although I must commend you for your optimism.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090816/ap_on_go_...
n/t
If that makes you feel better, go knock yourself out. I am not willing to read the tea leaves to interpret what Obama is for or against.
Edit to add: Even when the secretary of the HHS dept. and a key Dem senator go on record saying that the public option is pretty much dead, are people still willing to give Obama a free pass?
This is a painful new tactic. Where Obama's plans make sense, the rethugs can simply claim they don't believe it, because gummint is untrustworthy.
DICK...Salvation Army!
Study the symptoms not the virus...
these guys named DICK....Nixon, Cheney, Armey....??
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
Conservative Family Values hard at work.
Lying through every orifice available.
.
Dick Armey is a joke.
Dick Armey is a tool of almost inconceivable magnitude. His smarmy, skeevy condescension to Rachel Maddow this morning left me wanting more, so much more.
Rachel, I beg you, invite this unregenerate gas bag on to your show. There will be no David Gregory playing an actor playing a journalist. Let Dick's Army put up with YOUR format, YOUR rules by which I mean a civil discourse that allows bullshit to be called bullshit when bullshit is bullshit.
...
SARGE, I mean serge. :)Study the symptoms not the virus...
Tort reform has never and will never decrease health care costs. Corporations use tort reform as a business expense. They can cripple, maim and kill you but their costs have a ceiling w/o consequences to the "maim-er". It is a part of the cost but not the significant role that those assholes (GOP) claim.
That'll take that talking point off the table. How about capping the pain and suffering and covering lifetime related medical costs?
Some have been around for decades, like the Medical Liability and Insurance Improvement Act of 1977, which some state courts have ruled applies to insurance companies, not individuals or doctors.
In 1986, my husband was killed by an unlicensed ambulance attendent,and the law limited the liability of ambulance services to $300,000. The Federal DOT position was, poor service is better than no service, and I still have the memo stating that. Could the suit have demanded more, yes, would we ever have seen the money, no.
Here in Florida, liability is capped on most claims regardless the circumstances leading up to the claim.
I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and to the republic which it established, one nation from many peoples, promising liberty and justice for all
We can't let them do this to us - we just can't.
*
That other guy is a dick too.
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
What're you gunna do. :)
Rachel may not teabag but she's good at beating Dick.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/16/madd...
dick is representing the paranoid wing-nuts.
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
An Armey of dicks.
Running tests is not the problem and frankly I'd be thrilled if my doctor would run every available test to find out what's wrong with me (assuming I had a doctor or insurance); the problem is when doctor's have a financial interest in the testing companies and are running tests simply to add to their bottom line.
Jiminy H. Cricket, if "tort reform" gets included in health care "reform" that'll be it, time to start packing. Endgame is at hand.
Docs should be salaried and not paid more per service given.
When 40% of healthcare costs are related to insurance overhead, i.e. money that has nothing to do with medical equipment and/or medical salaries. That should be the main focus of the reform, in comparison... medical salaries are a drop in the bucket.
I worked as an RN in Wyoming where this one doc ordered upper GIs on everyone he saw. He got a percentage. It's not the amount of money the docs make per se, but the extra cost of needless tests that the docs order when they get a cut.
How do you hide a dollar from an orthopod?
Put it in a textbook.
How do you hide a dollar from an infectious desease doc?
Put it on the patient.
How do you hide a dollar from a cardiologist?
You can't.
but Fox was the only one to have members of the AMA and AARP on in favor of healthcare reform while MTP and PBS get assholes like Armey.
Are you sure they weren't there to be trashed?
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
... I thought the AMA had come publicly against health care reform...
yourself. They both said they support Obama's plans.
serious reservations, esp. regarding the public option.
To me health care reform = at least some kind of public option. Anything else is just a simple reshuffle of the deck chairs.
No single payer. No Public option. We Might get a co op that's run as a non profit. Spineless fucktards.
Here
What is your conceptual, continuity?
Amen, brother. I have had enough of these political lamos and weaklings that think that compromise on this issue is the same as a principled stand. It sure as hell is not. It is flagrant cowardice and a straightforward admission that when things get tough, progressives and the policies we advocate are expendible.
Their flimsy ass excuse time is that "this will just take time." 47 million people don't have that luxury. They need help NOW! They are just giving future generations an IOU for their weakness and inability to stand for what is right.
I think progressives should give strong consideration to abandoning the GOP Lite Democrats and go with the Green Party. I'ts about time for a third party anyway.
"We will find fulfillment not in the goods that we have, but in the good we can do for each other."
Robert F. Kennedy
The cowardly loin comes to mind.
Lemee at um, Lemee at um! Then they run and hide cowering.
And I so Loath Dick Armey.
What is your conceptual, continuity?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=dib2-HBsF08
And I'm not taking it anymore!
"We will find fulfillment not in the goods that we have, but in the good we can do for each other."
Robert F. Kennedy
If only it would work. We've been mad as hell, won the last election in a landslide. now this.
What is your conceptual, continuity?
The landslide is being mudslided.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Cowardly loin...probably closer to the truth than using lion.
;o}
I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and to the republic which it established, one nation from many peoples, promising liberty and justice for all
Thanks. I got a snicker out of my slop up.:)
What is your conceptual, continuity?
you mean cowardly shrinking loin.
Cowardly loin,
Having trouble getting it up?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
But it's lean.:)
What is your conceptual, continuity?
Well, maybe the Green Party will have an impact, or even win a natonal election....sometime around 2040. In the meantime, thanks you petulant Dems (mainly progressives), the GOP will have their new Dick Arney/Newt Gingrich/Sarah Palin/Grover Norquist Permanent Majority for 30 years....
I sympathize with you, believe me, but I don't want the next couple of decades to be run by the Republican party.
However I have had about enough of well meaning politicians that only project an image of competence and courage, but when tough times come they bail out to uphold the status quo, essentially delaying the heavy lifting to the future.
If enough concerned people rise up to make a difference, then real change will come a lot sooner. Your attitude creates your reality. If you believe the Greens will be effective in 2040, than that's exactly what you will get. Personally, I have no time to wait that long.
"We will find fulfillment not in the goods that we have, but in the good we can do for each other."
Robert F. Kennedy
So the dick want's to get rid of Medi-Care too! what a dick!
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
They don't call him "Dick" for just any other reason.
Calling Barney Frank "Barney Fag" was just one of many reasons this Dick gave Dick Cheney a run for the money for DC's biggest Dick.
that either one measures up to big dick? I doubt it.
No, I doubt they have 7 inches between them which is part of the reason they are such big dicks in the figurative sense.
Freedumb Watch:
Freedom of a woman to terminate a pregnancy? No. Freedom of gays and lesbians to marry? No. Freedom of Dick's Army to make complete asses of themselves, show how cluesless they are, spread and legislate intolerance hatred and bigotry, terrorize the American people possibly even killing innocent Americans and threaten the President of the United States with murder? Yes! Gotta protect that freedumb at all costs!
One of Armey's arguments this AM on Meet the Press was to allow people to purchase health care insurance from another state. Maddow pretty well shot him down with the question about "awesome" policies in other states. But looking further into this, if we can cross lines to purchase health care, who will regulate it? There is a Republican sponsored bill out there that wants to federalize insurance regulation with a commission in the department of Treasury. Surprise, surprise! It is designed by the Republicans to cut down on consumer protection available in most states. States rights turned on its head for corporations and against consumers!
and add in Holy Tort Reform, and the insurance companies will be saving billions more...at the expense of the sick and injured!
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
Move the litigation from State courts to Federal courts that they have been stacking for years.
Dick Armey is an oxygen thief, is RFK safer for the mods here? Trust me 9/11 has turned America into a nation of bedwetters. OK, they always were, 9/11 made it more apparent. Offence (offense) is never given, it's always taken. If you really care about the level of discourse you have to put your head in the same hat these criminals wear. It's quite simple. Tito in Jugoslavia perfected that. Idiots with guns will dance around until someone says stop.
Sign me up for a passport to Juggoslavia.
http://www.dating-world.net/W%20DATA/w%20data...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
http://wtc.laibach.org/category.cp2?guid=694D...
I can't vouch for Tito personally, but I'm sure Liz Taylor can. She was hanging with the big Tito in Brioni (it's for sale, by the way) while Richard Burton was playing him in a Jugo/Yugo .... film mid 70's. Tito was a player. Hell, Madame (not sure if that was her profession) Thatcher attended his funeral, sly dog that he was. OK... he screwed evryone but his wife.
Kirsch is correct. Most individual bankruptcies occur today due to the huge medical costs individuals are stuck with afterwards. Its funny how many of those protesting the Obama plan are themselves on some sort of government health care coverage liked medicare. When you ask them why they are on it they state that they cannot afford the costs for their medical treatments.
Keep the system as is, and just watch how many more bankruptcies occur.
Dick Armey is an authoritarian, condescending bully who is a malignant tumor on the body of our politics. The less I see of this piece of toxic waste the better.
"We will find fulfillment not in the goods that we have, but in the good we can do for each other."
Robert F. Kennedy
But because individual bankruptcies have been "reformed" those who find themselves in such a situation often have to be foreclosed on, adding additional strain to real estate, the banking and credit industry, and all those with banking accounts or simply looking for household or business loans.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
I agree that if Obama caves in to these hate monguering, racist, terrorists in the Right Wing, I will never vote Democratic again as I have always done. Just can't give into these uneducated lunatic Reslugs.
OK,stop voting Democratic if you're in a state represented by one of these three.....But don't take it out on the whole party. Or, put otherwise, if you don't get 100% of what you want why would you be willing to let the slimeball Republicans benefit from your anger?
It just doesn't make sense.
Armey would probably be unable to buy insurance; most people over 55 have preexisting conditions. Few of us are as wealthy as Armey who is able to "self insure."
Existing.
Congressmen are covered by their free health insurance at taxpayers expense for the rest of their lives as long as they serve a minimum number of years, which I think is only five years.
Whether they have to pay for their families I don't know.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Families do qualify, even after divorce:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
I love those Republicans. They trot out some dubious statistic from a government source, then we're they're shown to be "misinformed", they say, well, it doesn't matter. People don't trust the government.
Just as speaking out of one side of their mouth they'll tell you just how bad and inefficient gvt is at managing anything,
Then out of the other (and often nearly simultaneously) will tell you that somehow a public option will
run the private sector out of business.
The "Duh Factor" is amazing with Repubicans. Especially people who believe them....
fall in love with their insurance company? Who cares if they go out of business if there is a better alternative?
Place that man under cardiac arrest.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
And some village must be missing their idiot as well. Come back Dickie, your fellow circus freaks miss you.
"We will find fulfillment not in the goods that we have, but in the good we can do for each other."
Robert F. Kennedy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNBNqUdqm1E&fe...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
You mean Armey, right?? #:)
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
Guess I should have been clearer!
"We will find fulfillment not in the goods that we have, but in the good we can do for each other."
Robert F. Kennedy
Put all these recidivists in one place and let natural selection work its charm?
The idea that tort reform is needed is a joke.
They seek to get rid of the pain and suffering part of medical lawsuits, because that's where the bigger dollars come in.
But without pain and suffering one: you cannot really punish the offending corporation because the cost has to hurt.
Two: I suspect that most hospital admissions has clauses requiring mediation or arbitration if there are any disputes. If I remember aright both the mediator and the arbitrator's decisions are legally binding, but the former you can take to a court of original jurisdiction if displeased with the results, and the latter to a court of appeal, where it would be heard by a panel of three judges, with no jury prone to emotional sway. Three: Without pain and suffering what you have is essentially no long a tort at all but a business case, where a value will be assigned to your arm or leg or child's life. But indubitably the arm of a NASCAR driver would be considered more valuable than the arm of a custodian who sweeps floors.
We saw that when attempts at restitution were made after 9-11.
And on the rare case there is a big pay out to the claimant, the standard burden is what would a reasonable physician under the circumstances do? And then the damages are generally lowered by the appeals court.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
I think dick army needs to see a brain specialist.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrjHKMJTh1w
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
Needs to start with culling liars like these. You can't trust these scum bags. They can't even lie very well. They need to be taken behind the wood shed and ...
I fear Americans aren't smart enough to do what is in their best interest. They need one thing, and are willing to die fighting to support the policies that will kill them. A lose lose situation.
Socail evolution will evenually take it's course.
Dick has to laugh before he tells his lies .
kinda like Reagen , it's all in the delivery
The opponents to single payer are like Tito's partisans. Self important ignorant peasants with guns. And yes, they will shoot you given a chance. Don't give them that chance, don't be a bed wetter. No more Mr. nice guy. Obama needs to act like he has 60 votes in the senate. I could be wrong, but screw these assholes and vote in the primaries and school board stuff. Time for some cevapcici. Pork included.
Dick Armey all over the tv today.
Guess he decided the Sabbath was a good day to rest from all the insurance company C********* he does all the rest of the week.
Vote GOP and move forward to the 18th Century.
I suggest SWARMING freedom works with tens of thousands of emails asking Hot Tub Dick, how it could be that if tort reform is the answer, why does Mcallen Texas have the highest cost healthcare in the US, YEARS after Texas enacted EXACTLY the tort reform he proposes for the whole country?
Go get the rotten liars:
http://www.freedomworks.org/contact
Just to give you an idea of the level of insanity you will encounter at Freedomworks, their website claims that health insurance companies SUPPORT the DEMOCRATIC health reform proposals.
Shouldn't this stuff be illegal?
That stupid, greedy motherfucker is another second closer to death. Nature has a death panel of its own.
Dick, you douchebag, as a rich old asshole, you can afford to go get private insurance. Not everyone can, you stupid, selfish prick.
If there was a God, this prick would die horribly and painfully in the most expensive manner to his family, leaving them bankrupt and having to pay millions to put them in debt.
"But I have to tell you, if you take a look at the unrest that you see brewing in America today, it's precisely because the American citizenry at large does not believe what the government and agents of the government are telling them."
Yes Dick that's right.
Why?Because you and your friends have been spreading malicious lies about public insurance.That's why.
"To me, truth is not some vague, foggy notion. Truth is real. And,
at the same time, unreal. Fiction and fact and everything in between,
plus some things I can't remember, all rolled into one big "thing."
This is truth, to me. "
-Jack Handy
Armey says you will lose your Social Security if you don't sign up for Medicare or you drop your Medicare coverage. I've never ever heard of this before. Has anyone here heard that? BTW, when you sign up for Medicare you have the option to sign up with a couple of insurance companies like Humana instead of what the government offers. You even have a choice with Medicare.
Dick is a shill for the Insurances Companies...He is a Partisan Right-Wing Republican. I don't believe he is looking out for my best interest. He wants President Obama to fail. I want Health Care Reform... The Private Insurance Companies are killing us.
Why is this a-hole (Dick Armey) weighing in on the subject of health care anyway. The notion that tort reform is the answer to fixing our broken healthcare system is a total canard. In fact, if all Americans had access to healthcare, they'd be far less inclined to sue to cover their medical expenses when things go wrong. Mal practice law suits are a drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things.
The procedures are necessary to properly diagnose. And the doctors know it. What Armey wants here is for the doctors to spend as little as possible diagnosing a patient, and to just go with the numbers. "Well, 85% of people who come in with these symptoms have X. So let's treat this patient for X." And in case you're one of those unlucky statistically abnormal 15%, Armey wants to make sure that the doctors can't be SUED for any deaths or such which result from improper diagnosing and improper treatment.
This man should be ashamed of himself. He'd sell his own mother if he had another one left to sell.
Is that whatever they say it will look sound or feel nothing like reality!
republicanism is a mental illness!
He did it politely, with facts and reasoning, and he still kicks Armey's ass all around the stage. What he did here should be studied by Democrats EVERYWHERE.
the democratic party seems to be shooting at their feet.
They're so intent on appeasing pharma and the insurance companies, they have completely discounted everyone else. And I'm not talking about the little guy (because frankly they always do that). I'm talking about business.
If they had gone with a single payer plan they could have sold it to corporations as a benefit to them. Health insurance is a major expense for companies. Not only do they have to pay the premiums on insurance for their employees, they have to administer the plans as well. So even if their taxes increased to pay for a single payer option for all Americans, it probably wouldn't be as much as they pay now in premiums. And even if it was as much, they would still save by being able to drop their administration costs.
Instead we're going with the public option (unless we weenie out of that too), and instead, this is what business is going to hear:
"Your employer's coverage would have to meet certain minimum standards, so the benefits would have to be good, and the employer would have to pay for a decent amount of your coverage. So that's private insurance at work."
Spoken by Richard Kirsch, bolding mine.
So, not only have we managed to NOT sell healthcare to the economic interests in this country, we have managed to ensure their opposition.
At least we're consistent.
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