As Think Progress noted, John McCain doesn't mind cracking down on the illegal immigrants who are crossing the borders to find work, but when it comes to doing something about those businesses that hire them... maybe not so much.
McCain: Enforce Immigration Laws On Undocumented Workers, But Not On Businesses That Hire Them:
Since Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer (R) signed the state’s new anti-immigrant bill into law last month, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) has been a fervent supporter. The law gives state police broad power to identify, detain, and deport undocumented immigrants. McCain, who called the law a “good tool,” said last night on Fox News that he is “proud of the work” Brewer is doing on immigration, and justified the law “because the federal government would not enforce its responsibilities.”
But while McCain offers support for this new draconian law targeting day-laborers and other undocumented immigrants, he is not in favor of enforcing laws prohibiting employers from hiring undocumented workers. Instead, he would rather “secure the borders” before holding Arizona businesses accountable to the law.
As they point out this is just another flip-flop for the not-so-mavericky McCain:
Back in 2007, McCain wanted to “strengthen the laws and penalties against those who hire illegal aliens and violate immigration law.” Now, it seems that McCain is all for enforcing immigration laws when when it is politically convenient, as Arizona businesses are presumably more organized and have more money and influence than the state’s undocumented workers.
This man just gets more pathetic by the day as this Senate race of his goes on. Van Susteren at least asked a decent question here but of course with no follow up, like telling him that his answer is completely ridiculous. I used to get sick of the same stuff out of Lou Dobbs who would attack the poor people coming here looking for work night after night on his show, but never made it a point to highlight the businesses that were hiring them.
You dry up the employment and they're not going to be flooding over the border. We've got businesses addicted to slave labor and politicians who would rather demonize the slaves than fix the trade laws that destroyed their small farms and drove them here to begin with. And round and round we go. Step on the little guy's neck, pit the workers against each other that should be on the same side of an issue and give the big guys taking advantage of everyone a pass.
VAN SUSTEREN: Governor Brewer, how is she doing on this issue?
MCCAIN: I'm very proud of work she is doing. And I'm glad she highlighted the fact that the president would make a joke out of problems on our border and the laws that our legislature passed.
And again, you can't make it up, when the attorney general of the United States says that he's going to consider going to court and then tests before Congress that he hasn't read the bill.
VAN SUSTEREN: Do they not understand the -- it seems the people of Arizona are begging for it. I read the statute, and I think it is an effort to run immigration policy which the state is not supposed to run under the constitution. But I see it as a cry for help from Arizona.
MCCAIN: I just think it is exactly as you said. It is a reaction to the failure of the federal government to exercise its responsibility to secure the border. And by the way, our governor will point out the cost are horrendous of illegal immigration into our state in law enforcement, health care, so many other ways.
Do not underestimate the sophistication of the human smugglers and the drug cartels. They work together. You hear a lot about human rights in this debate. You don't hear much about the fact of the abuse of these people that these coyotes are bringing across, holding them for ransom, jamming into trucks, mistreating them in the worst possible way.
You would think that human rights advocate was say let's secure the border so over time we can bring people into our country in an orderly fashion and not be subject to you these abuses. The drug cartels are right along with them.
VAN SUSTEREN: What about businesses who hire people who are not documented?
MCCAIN: Once we secure the borders we should prosecute employers to the fullest extent of the law that hire someone that's in this country illegally.
VAN SUSTEREN: Why wait to secure the borders? Why can't we do those two things at the same time?
MCCAIN: I think you could you do some of that. But the fact is if you have an unending stream of people into the country then, obviously, it's addressing the symptom, not the problem.
VAN SUSTEREN: Except for the fact that you don't have to hire someone how is undocumented if that is against the law. Maybe the law should be changed. Right now that is against the law.
MCCAIN: Yes, it is.
VAN SUSTEREN: So what about going after the companies?
MCCAIN: I think we should do that. But we should get the borders secure so there is not this symptom which is people coming to this country and working illegally.
I wonder how many "illegals" work for him and his wife at all those mansions and the beer distributor.
HA...now THAT would be great TV coverage.....the ICE swooping in on McCranypants homes and businesses!
all it takes is all of us
Annapolis Naval Academy graduates working on his lawn.
Or Yale and Harvard grads tending to the garden and the flower beds.
But of course, McCain showed in 2004, he know how to take care of Bush's on his own.
exactly.
I just went through hell to get here so damn it you better hire me. So, the employers should blame the illegal immigrant because they are forced to hire them.
Of course we all have known for some time Obi-Juan Kenobi and his Jedi's come to America and use Jedi mind tricks on unwitting employers.
Obi-Juan: You want to hire me
Employer: I want to hire you
Obi-Juan: You will pay me in cash
Employer: I will pay you in cash
Goodnight, Frau Blücher
Hey if it is someone making a profit on the illegals its a symptom...how incredibly backwards :(
Pretty pathetic. He's trying to out-teaparty his opponent and he's just not good at it.
They don't call him Johnny-come-Lately for nothing.
"Parachutes are allowed in checked or carry-on baggage, but may not be worn in flight."
---Southwest Airlines
http://grhomeboy.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/...
?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
in better days.
"Parachutes are allowed in checked or carry-on baggage, but may not be worn in flight."
---Southwest Airlines
Really John? Really?
I think it's time we put Granpa in the home.
He already has eight...
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
obviously not enough.
Employers hirin' illegals wouldn't be a problem if there weren't so damn many of them crossin' the border!
My century will be made if McCain, Pearce, or Arpaio next tell us that Arizona simply needs 'breathing space.'
Arrest the workers, give the senators who employ them a free pass.
...And arrange for the "suicide" of the Madam who put them together.
by corporate merica....period.
hire an illegal get a 10k fine, do it again 100k, next time 1mill......soon no one will hire "illegals" and therefore they will have no reason to come here.....simple....enforce and increase penalties on employers.....period.
Cue the Kabuki....
throw them in prison. They are undermining the American way of life, in many cases evading taxes and paying these people below minimum wages.
"enforce and increase penalties on employers"
Yup.... lock em' up, fine em', hang em' from the gallows pole for all I care.
Also, hiring illegals IS "da merican way" .... greed, more greed, and greed at any cost is the "way of life" for merican capitalism.
Cue the Kabuki....
are we talking about the illegals or the senators here......
The logic used by these people will make you dizzy! Glad he is not Pres. But it does look as though everyone in washington is on the take. Even the pres looks like he is owned by the corps.
Sick.
Greed and a belief in
white supremisimamerican exceptionalism. We as good people need to reject that assumption and fight it.FINALLY! I have been ranting about this for a few years! But the MSM always portrays it in a simplistic way -- with the "dangerous" Mexicans the only topic. Not the businesses that hire them. And Wal Mart is a HUGE one -- in CA, AZ, and TEXAS. Oh, those businesses just love paying their workers $2.00 an hour. And, of course, if the businesses WERE cracked down on, the same Americans that are screaming NOW about the illegals, will be screaming about how much everything costs.
Make up your "mind" imbeciles -- do you want illegals, or do you want to pay more for your food? (To say nothing of hotel fees, nannies, etc.)
to pay them less does not relate to lower prices necesarily. It raises profit and dividends. Just like outsourcing manufacturing jobs, you don't see Nike's prices getting lower because they outsource where they mnufacture the shoes, but you see higher profits and dividends.
thats the same bs argument that was used by reagan
it doesnt hold water
the reason people cant afford things is because wages have remained stagnant or even dropped, since the clinton years
if you make more...you can afford more
im tired of the myth of the 5 dollar head of lettuce
on corporate farms, labor is the lowest cost
as for nannies...the only reason people need them is because to make ends meet, almost every family has to have two working parents
so step off with that bullshit
it was created by the corporatists in order to placate the masses in regards to allowing in cheap labor
Conservatives will go to the mat to preserve the rights of the wealthy to screw people. But when the conservatives get screwed as a result, it's all the "government's" fault.
From http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=arizona+...
California has 6 times the population of Arizona,
Arizona has a much higher crime rate.
An old retired fart.
.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
Wisconsin has more cows than Arizona,
Arizona has a much higher crime rate.
has the highest rate of drug and alcohol abuse as well as child abuse in the nation
kill whitey
He has no idea where he stands on anything anymore. That's why he was the subject of several of my song parodies (http://pickwaynesbrain.wordpress.com/2010/05/...).
.
Build it and they will come...
... Offer jobs and people will show up for employment opportunities.
Maybe the Senile Senator McJohnny can figure this out...
... Maybe.
.
Starve the WAR Beast...
... Save the World.
sometimes people like alex jones come up with some clever gimmicks, like his "prison planet" meme, of course he has no solutions; first it is the big bad capitalists, then a socialist conspiracy headed by the rockefellers. the thing is, in the midst of the bs there is often a kernel of truth which is used to push the rest of the hokum.
immigration is the same deal, the issue is global capital and multinational corps ripping off working people. the southern border is one part of a broader issue; another part of the same issue to me is H1B visas, where employers bring in foreign workers for tech jobs and get away with paying less than they would americans. a member of my family has gone to school, and into debt, to get a college degree, and then found no job for her - but one for the guy from india.
everyone focuses on the southern border, but to me what some of these corps are doing with H1B is just as illegal.
mccain, the consistency maverick, appears to be trying to tap into the libertarian leanings of the GOP base
like rand paul's comments about segregated lunch counters, mccain is trying to argue the business-as-untouchable view, although not as honestly as dr. paul
"We can't go after business owners who hire illegal immigrants Greta because that is my base and where the hell else am I going to raise money so I can put out ads where I get to use the werd 'dang'. It's that simple Greta.
Old Johnny has got a point it's incredibly hard to walk and chew gum at the same time.
Grampy McCain needs to retire. He's flipped on everything he ever stood for and yet Kerry is called a 'serial flip flopper'.
Maybe he's just senile and forgets what he originally stood for.
* and to anyone who wants to whine about my lack of respect for this guy, be sure to pull the purple bandaid off of your arm and go read his biography and ask him why he was crying below decks about his career while his boat was in flames and why he thinks Keating 5 should be carved on his headstone....THEN tell me why I should respect this guy.
crazy about a lot of stuff Obama has done, whenever I hear Sen. McGoo venture to speak coherently on ANY subject, I'm so glad he and Miss Sarah are not in the White House, yew betcha'!
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
A M E N
who can't remember what their opinion was on an issue last week, never mind last year, a symptom.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
Why doesn't John McCain ever talk about his quest to go to the gates of Heaven and Hell to find Osama Bin Laden who allegedly was behind the attacks on New York on 9/11.
In the presidential campaign he said he knew where he was. Has this whole thing turned into a joke, a useful and simple campaign trick?
"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people." ~ Eleanor Roosevelt
Indeed...say, wasn't he talking about how he 'knew how to get bin Laden' a while back???? I mean, like, has he ever offered that solution to the president...?? oh....yeah......
in my opinion, illegal immigrants are encouraged to enter the u.s. by both the government and corporations. of course, this has been going on for years but it has reached a "tipping point". the numbers are unmanageable and having a NET negative on our economy, environment and culture.
i was honestly concerned about this way before the "great recession". it's not about race it's about space. actually about 40% of the illegal immigrants are people who came here on visa and didn't return to their orgin. there are a few strategies for this movement: reduce wages, reduce workers comp.,tax base, provide unskilled labor and have bodies for the military. often not always these people are taken advantage of which is a labor/human rights issue. many are underpaid. many receive tax based public services. the illegal immigrant demographic is subsidized by u.s. tax payers at a time when services are being reduced...are more expensive and are backed by a decreasing supportive tax base participants. in addition to that it's understood that a % of income earned by illegal immigrants is sent to their country of orgin. i don't have the answer(s) to this issue.... something has to be done but neither party wants to really do anything.
"the illegal immigrant demographic is subsidized by u.s. tax payers"
How do we know this? This is certainly the message the msm feeds us constantly. In reality, if the people in question are undocumented then anything projected upon them is more in the realm of conjecture rather than fact.
This is what I see. In my community there are people who would surely be targeted under SB 1070. I see them buying cars, gasoline, groceries, eating in restaurants, buying clothes, starting up businesses, paying suppliers for their business, and on and on. In other words they are participating and contributing to their/our communities, and who is to say whether they are ultimately a plus or minus on our economy? The answer undoubtedly will depend on one's biases and befief systems, but it's all speculation to support one's world view.
I for one think the US is missing the boat. Everyone should be welcomed. If they want to be citizens, or not, make it easy for someone to come here, work, leave, come back, send their kids to school, all the things people should have the right to pursue while trying to provide for themselves and their families.
If it were easy for people to come here to better themselves, then it would be easier to keep track of them and also collect taxes, fees, and whatever other costs may be contained in the priviledge of coming here for a better life.
Everyone wins in this scenario. The US is again seen as a place for the "huddled masses yearning to breath free..." Employers can hire workers legally. Our culture is enriched with diversity. And the whole thing will be bathed in light rather than this fearful, bigoted darkness that surrounds this sad chapter in human history.
Most all of us, if we go back through our lineage, were illegal here in one form or another. Why are we any better? We should never forget where we came from and that we all on this planet are human and one. More compassion and human empathy is needed here rather than harsher laws.
maybe we can agree to disagree or if easier your correct i'm absolutely incorrect/misinformed. illegal immigration is an absolute NET positive in all areas. how's that?
Who the hell cares if people cross the border illegally, if they aren't taking jobs? What are you afraid is going to happen? Oh no, they might visit the Grand Canyon! Maybe they'll go visit their families! And spend money in our restaurants and grocery stores... wait, this is a bad thing? (A racist would be upset about having more brown people in the country, whether they were "taking jobs" or not... and of course some Mexican women will sneak into the country just to have their babies here!)
McCain has it bass-ackwards.
in a long list of examples, of another lying, hypocritical scoundrel. As far as I'm concerned almost all politicians, given enough time in the "business," lose/sell their souls if they had one to began with.
Some may run for office with good intentions, but before too long they all become scoundrels - the difference is only to what degree.
Everyone with any kind of brain knows the culprit here is NAFTA, but all these scoundrels will talk about are the "illegal immigrants" and all the havoc they are producing. Talking out of both sides of one's mouth is not a lost art in politics.
Big business is thriving under NAFTA as everyone else is left to scramble for the few remaining crumbs. It's only a matter of time that some of these American workers loudly calling for stricter immigration laws will be forced to cross some line of legality as they too struggle to try and feed themselves and their families.
It's a bait and switch crock of bullsh*t we're handed with a compliant msm at the ready to grease the shameful path. I can only hope that the world gets to some sort of critical mass of awareness and steps up united and enmass to change all of this for the betterment of all.
In the meantime everyone is doing what they can to survive and I find it hard to be critical of anyone in this position as long as they don't resort to violence. Unfortunately, if it doesn't get better for people it may just be a matter of time until we see a rise in that as well.
It's the scoundrels that have brought this on to the world - they will be the last to admit it.
Whether or not you believe, Mr. McCain is suffering from some form of senile dementia (and I could cite numerous video clips indicating unambiguous symptoms), he is certainly suffering from some form of mental obsolescence. McCain has proven himself out of touch with the facts for nearly a decade now. Ultimately it doesn't matter whether he's simply incapable of remembering facts or whether he's merely being fed self-serving political talking points by his advisers. We need to take pity on this poor man and send him to a pleasant retirement.
and he knows it
a symptom?
eff you, you old fart
this ass spends more money going out EAT than most Americans make in a year. Hey Jon McNut, where is that $50 anhe you said YOY would pay for pickers when you were running for pres. this dirt bag talks out his ass most all the time. He is smarter than most of us. How many people do you know have! Went and looked for a wife wortg 150 million,then dump your wife, them hook up with a sugar moma. This gal must be just dumer than a box of rocks.
As the people comming over, hell the ones who are here legal hate the ones comming over. One thing That needs to be changes are the Kids. If there parent brings them over when they are little and this is all they know they should have a chance to stay. To them the U.S. is there home.
the table...cuz im ready, willing and able
you old coot
When the issue is prostitution or drugs, the conservatives want to go after the demand side--bust johns and users. But when the users are the Chamber of Commerce, it's the supply side that is the problem.
Like the time I took the ferry to Shelbyville. I needed a new heel for my shoe so I decided to go to Morganville, which is what they called Shelbyville in those days. So I tied an onion to my belt, which was the style at the time. Now to take the ferry cost a nickel, and in those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on them. Give me five bees for a quarter you'd say. Now where were we, oh ya. The important thing was that I had an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time. They didn't have white onions because if the war. The only thing you could get was those big yellow ones.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
:)
Geeezus John, just shut up. It sounds like Palin is writing your talking points.
Vote GOP and move forward to the 18th Century.
now that this Goose steppin Racist Nazi tries again to confuse the issues are there any buyers.
Leave it to a White Supremacist Racist Nazi to Marginalize the Thieves Crooks and Liars because this Goose stepper needs their DOLLARS.
Yeah right people risk everything for Nothing you Lying Lame Brain GUTLESS TRAITOR.
This is maybe the best one I have heard yet ! The illegal hiring of illegal immigrants IS the F'n problem , enforce the law and the problem , 90 % of it , will take care of itself . The politicians and their corporate masters don't want the law enforced so the puppet politicians pretend it's a complicated matter and will do and say anything but enforce the law . How about the US start insisting on change , better conditions and better pay in Mexico ? Insist on human rights and justice ? Maybe those poor people wouldn't have to come here ? Ohhhhhhhhh no , can't do that ! The same thing in regards to China , now the dreaded Commies are our best pals , they bank roll us and make the Corporations and Wall Street fat cats more money with their endless cheap labor . Damn I hope this guy loses in the next election , what a disgrace he has become .
"The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all."
is bat shit nuts too! When he lost, he cryed like a Bitch. could not make it in TV sports either.
You have a point there , McCain's opponent is a real gem too .
"The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all."
I wonder why McCain doesn't apply his policy of not being to harsh on companies which hire illegals, to things like drug abuse, sexual abuse, drunk drivers, and maybe even murderers.
Shouldn't we take it easy on all those who violate the law, until we can solve the root problems which tempt people to become violators?
It's all the same, isn't it, Johnny? Or is there a special place in your interpretation of Justice which excludes your corporate buddies?
They're sure as hell not coming across the border for the beer (Budweiser) that McCain's wife's family distributes. Almost any Mexican beer, including el cheapo Tecate, is better than that swill.
Naco is a small town in the middle of a valley on the Mexican border. As you come down from Bisbee, you can see the town as a group of buildings surrounded by the emptiness of the high desert. As you drive closer the eye can make out a fence that runs the length of the valley, right through the middle of Naco. On one side is Naco Arizona. On the other is Naco Sonora.
At one time Naco was just Naco, part of Mexico. Then some folks decided we might need the area for a railroad and sent a guy named Gadsden to buy a big enough hunk of Mexico to make that possible. A threat was delivered, a sale was made, and a line was drawn on a page. If you lived on one side of that line you were an American citizen. Otherwise, you were Mexican.
A while back I travelled to Naco AZ to visit an old buddy. He was teaching school there. The school actually backed up on the international fence.
If you want to see for yourself how government policies affect normal people, Naco is a good place to go. There is a brisk trade from Americans crossing over to buy drugs manufactured in America but somehow vastly less expensive when you buy them in Mexico. And there is a stream of people that gather on the Mexican side, preparing to cross over for work they can not get legally.
We stopped to chat with some men waiting in the shade of a small tree. They were from a small village in the interior, headed for Indiana to work in a meat packing plant. Somebody’s cousin already worked there. Ha dicho un pajarito. Heard it on the grapevine.
The men were calm, waiting lazily in the shade. Over the next few days they would make a dangerous crossing through a hostile desert. They would make a crowded and uncomfortable journey halfway across America. They would take work in a meat packing plant, live six to ten to an apartment, eat beans and rice, have an occasional beer and, every other week or so, they would send all their other money back home.
They will work for less, work harder than most, never complain. Using forged documents, they will pay their withholding taxes and social security tax just like most of us. But they won’t get to vote and they will not be getting social security payments on retirement.
These are our illegals, as the conservatives like to call them. Common criminals.
There are, of course, two criminals implicit in each furtive border crossing. There is the illegal immigrant, and on the other end, an illegal employer. One doesn’t exist without the other.
There is and has always been an elegant and simple solution to the illegal immigration problem…enforce the laws on hiring illegal immigrants. No fences, no additional border patrols, Pat and Lou are happy again. However, in the face of a growing problem, work-site enforcement was scaled back 95% between 1999 and 2003. In 1999 over 400 cases of illegal hiring were prosecuted. In 2003 the number of prosecutions, for the entire United States, was three. Why?
The answer is illustrated nicely by what happened in Georgia in 1998. Immigration cracked down just as the Vidalia onions were ripening. Twenty eight workers were arrested and deported. Onion growers couldn’t find enough people for the harvest. Calls were made…Congress critters got involved. The crackdown ended…abruptly. Those same Congress critters, having solved the Vidalia onion problem, returned their energies to the task of defeating immigration reform. Somewhere in Mexico a man kissed his wife and children goodbye and started the long trek to Georgia.
The great irony of illegal immigration is that it is a problem because it solves so many problems. The immigrant finds work that pays more…and employers find workers who will accept less.
An equal irony is apparent in the political calculus behind the angst over illegal immigration. The noise is all coming from the right, rooted in racism. But the real victim is the American worker, whose wage is forever dragged down by this endless source of cheap labor.
The solution is to increase immigration quotas to provide an adequate workforce of legal immigrants… and get serious about work-site enforcement. The Georgia onion crop can be harvested. Onion growers will have to pay more…maybe even enough that unemployed Americans will want the job.
I have spent time on the border. My family is from the border areas. Half of my mother's family crossed the border at some time, the other half had the border cross over them. I still have family who live in the border regions.
I have known many people who were here illegally over my years. People from Mexico, South America, Central America, Europe, Asia, and the Middle East - different colors, different religions. All of them to a person were contributing to our culture and our economy - all hard working at striving. I've have met people who were born here who didn't contribute as much.
This debate is bogus and intended to distract us from what really is destroying our society, our middle class, and working people all over the world - the industrial, corporate, military complex and fueled by fear, xenophobia, and racism by a cynical ruling elite class.
This is someone who subscribes to Free Market principles, yet doesn't appear to understand supply and demand.
Americans hiring illegals create the market for more illegals.
Let's break it down for Senator McCain: If you're looking for a jug of milk, you go to the store that sells milk. If the store stops selling milk, you don't go there anymore.
He knows, and he's lying because it doesn't fit in with his political narrative.
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