Obama Gets Biblical on Republican Tax Critics
President Barack Obama proved on Thursday that conservatives don't have a monopoly on using religion to advocate for specific public policies.
Speaking to a group of mostly-conservative politicians at the annual National Prayer Breakfast, the president quoted scripture in a effort to get Republicans to support a fairer tax code and caring for the poor.
"When I talk about our financial institutions playing by the same rules as folks on main street, when I talk about making sure insurance companies aren't discriminating against those who are already sick or making sure that unscrupulous lenders aren't taking advantage of the most vulnerable among us, I do so because I genuinely believe it will make the economy stronger for everybody," Obama explained. "But I also do it because I know far too many neighbors in our country have been hurt and treated unfairly over the last few years. And I believe in God's command to love thy neighbor as thyself."
"And when I talk about shared responsibility, it's because I genuinely believe at a time when folks are struggling, at a time when we have enormous deficits, it's hard for me to ask seniors on a fixed income or young people with student loans or middle class families who can barely pay the bills to shoulder the burden alone. And I think to myself, if I am willing to give something up as someone who has been extraordinarily blessed, give up some of the tax breaks that I enjoy -- I actually think that's going to make economic sense."
He added: "But for me as a Christian, it also coincides with Jesus's teaching that for unto whom much is given, much shall be required."
"Treating others as you want to be treated, requiring much from those who have been given so much, living by the principle that we are our brother's keeper, caring for the poor and those in need, these values are old and they can be found in many denominations and many faiths and among many believers and among many non-believers. They're values that have always made this country great when we live up to them, when we just don't just give lip service to them, and we just don't talk about them one day a year."
EWWWWWW
That's what gripes me about the Republican Party. The Church has generally fled to the Republican Party, and they "wink" at the hypocrisy of the Party's stance on fairness in the marketplace, holding people accountable for crossing lines of integrity and morality. The Democratic Party hasn't been that good at pushing for people to be held accountable either, but at least they don't make speeches about not caring for the poor, and they don't push for the poor to pay their "fair share". Totally against any Biblical principles. Not that I'm that religious any more. It just is very annoying to me that religious people - people who look down their noses at the rest of us - talk one way when they are in church and talk another way when they are in the political realm.
When confronted with this on CNN - Republicans turned it around and said Jesus was actually talking about liberals who would dare use his words against them.
They are that warped in the head. It is impossible to get through to them, even when their own philosophy supports your argument.
Please tell me you're kidding.
One of them also said Jesus was against illegal immigrants, gays and saggy pants. Then there's this tidbit by chuckawala:
Aside from the typical lunacy, do you see what crops up as always? It's Obama's fault.
That doesn't even come close to making grammatical sense. I cannot think of a way their response can follow the criticism posed. 'From those to whom a lot is given, much is expected' is about 'liberals who would dare use Jesus' words against conservatives'? What?!
I know the Republicans are lying weasels who don't really believe in anything but their own greed, but can they at least make an effort with their bullshit, please? Five year olds could have more robust debates than them. They just reply to any valid criticism or point with a non sequitur and the discussion can go no further. I might as well say "The Civil War began because your mother's a gerbil".
But the gist of their argument was that liberals don't uphold the true beliefs of Jesus. That makes them the Pharisees. Which means that Obama is only making this argument about Jesus as a political tool - not as a sincere need to help the poor. It is ironic and hypocritical because their Republican ideology is explicitly about not helping the poor. One of them explained that poor people are lazy and so deserve their fate. We have heard this many times before. It is pretty much on par with most of the arguments I get from right-wingers.
The cognitive dissonance of a black man speaking the words of Jesus and meaning them is too much for small minds. See Ontario's study linking low IQ and conservatism to prejudice.
the fundamental belief that they are the true believers, God's chosen, the only real people and they just KNOW that, so it doesn't matter if their arguments have no logic or factual basis, it doesn't matter if they say total nonsense, if you are not one of them you just don't count and are subhuman. It's a mental illness.
Watch BBC documentary "The Power of Nightmares", available on YouTube.
In compliance with the ideas of Leo Strauss, "grandfather" of the neocon movement, the purpose of Christianity in the neocon movement has nothing to do with Christianity. Religion and patriotism are two of the Noble Lies which keep the lesser populace in place. The sole purpose of Christianity's inclusion is as a tool for the leader to tell the followers how to behave and react. What the Bible actually says does not matter. In the hands of the neocon leaders, the Bible says to obey Christian leaders, hate liberals, and eliminate taxes and regulations.
Also, it would make no difference to the base. They have been conditioned to only accept input from Fox, Limbaugh, Beck, and hate radio. Anything else is insulted and discarded. (Even our neocons at work dismiss every arguments with, "You're getting your arguments from liberal sources." One even did that to me when I pointed to an article discussing the congressional record, with long quotes from the congressional record. This was a few months after he sent me an article from Pravda.)
Peace
I must admit I watched that show a while back, but I don't recall that piece by Adam Curtis having anything to do, even remotely, with chasing true Christian Scotsmen.
Also given Christianity's history and context, it has everything to do with the neocon movement: Religion, and Christianity in particular, has always been a tool for controlling the masses.
CTHULHU 2012 "Why vote for a lesser evil?"
That's how they can buy into nonsense history like the claim that the Nazis were socialists. Anyone who does some research will find that this is utter nonsense, but it doesn't matter to them. They will just say that any contradicting evidence comes from liberal historians who are rewriting history. An ironclad pathology.
I watched & listened to most of Obama's Prayer Breakfast speech - about 15 minutes.
And my deep revulsion at his faith in an invisible non-existent celestial father figure, and his appearcance at a "Christian" event in the first place were strongly tempered by his use of biblical references to flog the hypocrites in the audience.
Now I wish he'd go home and take a good look in the mirror at his own hypocritical ways.
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
They both quote the Golden Rule.
At least we know their opposition to the golden rule is not pure racism or obnoxious obstructionism. Apparently they just hate Jesus.
It disgusts me that he would even agree to appear at that atrocious gathering.
Progressives should hammer the fuck out of these hypocrites, but then the corporate media would probably ignore them or they'd get killed like true fighter Paul Wellstone or/and the others.
"If we don't fight hard enough for the things we stand for, at some point we have to recognize that we don't really stand for them."
-- Paul Wellstone
"Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people." ~ Eleanor Roosevelt
“If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn't help the poor, either we have to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we've got to acknowledge that He commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition and then admit that we just don't want to do it.”
― Stephen Colbert
I think some of you people need to get over yourselves.
Freedom Isn't Free, So Stop Whining And Pay Your Taxes.
"you people?"
CTHULHU 2012 "Why vote for a lesser evil?"
.
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
When Republicans talk about the Bible, they don't mean the parts about that namby, pamby, hippie, vagrant Jesus.
to them - "do not pray in public for it is only the hypocrites who pray in public"
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
...homosexuals, won't ever accept scripture that states you kill your disobedient children and stone to death the painted woman.
Mickey: "It was an epiphany. Do you know what an epipany is?"
Keoni: "NOT NOW MICKEY!"
Note that it's not hard to ask the struggling people to "shoulder the burden"; it's just hard to ask them to do it "alone."
Seniors on Medicare and Social Security didn't cause this financial mess we're in. Nor did the unemployed, students, or families struggling to meet their bills. So why do they all have to "share responsibility"? What's wrong with those who caused this mess taking full responsibility?
But that conversation is off the table. Perhaps it's off the table because of the $35,800 per plate dinners that Obama is holding at the only tables that really matter.
But it is an election year. So Obama can hardly openly campaign for even further wealth transfers to the top .01%. So he talks about "shared" sacrifice. Funny how the giants of finance didn't have to share any sacrifice back when Dems held majorities in both houses of congress as well as the White House. That discussion is only allowed when Dems have a ready excuse not to do it.
So how will this shared sacrifice work? Obama proposes sharing responsibility with the top .01%; Republicans say "no"; but both parties will still agree that the 99.99% should "shoulder the burden" with a small possibility of the .01% shouldering a fig leaf of some sort.
Just a wild guess.
Corruption favors the wealthy.
I guess he forgot that he is a Muslim, right? And isn't that a predominently "Christian" prayer breakfast, like the so-called make up of the country?
I agree on the "shared sacrifice" bullshit line; what he and the 1% mean by that is that the 99% should pick up 99% of the sacrifice.
And I pray that someday we have freedom from religion.
Move the Super Bowl to Sunday morning and count the empty church seats.
Corruption favors the wealthy.
what some of you think about what religion and the makeup of our president.
But he's a good looking guy to begin with.
Corruption favors the wealthy.
I'm sorry to say, that's the first thing I thought too, only I went straight to "just hard to ask them."
as most of you know the National Prayer Breakfast is a function of the family. and i think every president has crawled on all fours before this group of authoritarian theocrats since they started this travesty. but it still makes my skin crawl, as much as hearing the president sound like a pastor.
i vote to let conservative have that shitty monopoly on using faith for political goals.
of a day when an American president can tell Doug Coe to go pound sand and take his fucking prayer breakfast with him. Won't happen in my lifetime. They're a bunch of slimy bastards, and Christianity is just a convenient front for their operations.
President Barack Obama proved on Thursday that conservatives don't have a monopoly on using religion to advocate for specific public policies.
And this is a good thing???? Yikes.
far left loon >.<
In a secular democracy (supposedly) it is troubling to see religion used to drive or support public policy, no matter who is doing it or what that policy is. However, context is important, and what Obama seems to be doing is simply turning the tables on conservatives and trying to point out that they are not playing their own game by their own rules. It's clever politics, assuming the audience is remotely paying attention.
"[T]he breakfast is regarded by the Family as merely a tool in a larger purpose: to recruit the powerful attendees into smaller, more frequent prayer meetings, where they can 'meet Jesus man to man.'" -- jeff sharlet, The Family
this is not turning the tables, this is bowing before the same false idol.
You think they'll listen to him any more closely if he snubs them and tries to make points using their own faith from outside their room?
this is the belly of the beast of far right conservative theocrats: you think they will ever listen to president obama? if this group ever listened to obama that would mean that obama has adopted the family's antidemocratic, unchristian, totalitarian world-view.
let's not kid ourselves, this is not some non-partisan, non-ideological, non-authoritarian, non-secret bible reading group. this is The Family. if you are not familiar, you should read up. i don't fool myself in thinking that president obama has the political cajones to tell this assholes posing as pious paritioners to go take a dive--but let's make sure we call it like we see it.
Isn't Hillary Clinton a member of the Family (or am I mistaken)?
Edit: From Wiki
Edit #2: Keynote speakers 2010: Prime Minister José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton
far left loon >.<
she met with one of the womanfolk cells (yes, they call them 'cells' and yes the groups are segregated by gender)
http://motherjones.com/politics/2007/09/hilla...
i doubt she still meets with her "cell", but, golly, who knows
It's plain wrong and it reinforces the idea that America is a religious state when the president talks about God and policy together. Theocracy.
"I believe in God's command..."
"But for me as a Christian, it also coincides with Jesus's teaching..."
Get this out of politics please.
far left loon >.<
In a Nation over-populated with go to their graves dumbasses, the President has no choice.
Only winning against this bullshit will change things.
is that the same as talking to god? or is that just in my mind?
appeals to reason, to the supposed almighty, to the constitution, unalienable rights, all poppycock, this is all power politics pure and simple, same as it ever was. we have whatever rights society grants us, if some deity gave us rights, he sure as hell ain't around to enforce them.
it's hard to play the game with no rules, people want rules, they want to think they are right and the other side is wrong, evil, they're not, they are just someone you disagree with.
Yes !!
Talking to yourself counts as "talking to god".
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
I think at some point the question of evil, or at least maliciousness and greed that goes beyond disagreeing with somebody's position, has to be addressed. When banks wreck the economy of the entire planet through duplicitous, reckless, at times outright criminal lending practices, then are shored up by taxpayers and respond by sitting on their reserves so small businesses starve, then start using robots to sign foreclosure documents without any oversight and just plain steal people's homes and toss people out on the street just so they can have a building they will never be able to do anything with... we are beyond mere disagreement.
i agree with you, but then that is just my opinion. i am addressing the intellectual underpinnings, the habit people have of demonizing the opposition, the tendency of people to revert unconsciously to the good/bad, the "sin" narrative.
obama is addressing wealth inequity, he appeals to compassion, if the ruling class was compassionate there would be no wealth inequity. the appeal to a higher power only clouds the issue, the fact is that the 99% could seize power at anytime and feel justified, just as the 1% feel justified. i guess what i am trying to say is we need less morality and more ethics.
looking at the broad sweep of history the various sects have mostly felt justified oppressing non-believers. people feel that their wealth is justified because they are more moral, work harder, follow the one true god, whatever; we need to move the discussion away from pontificating and more towards the facts, and the fact is that all wealth is created by some sort of labor.
Whether or not some of the posters here believe in a higher power, a lot of people do, and Obama's their president, too. He needs to talk to them in a way they'll understand.
What BHO forgets is the conservatives don't really believe in the New Testament, just the Old. They need to hear the OT prophets who all had fits over defrauding widows and orphans, abusing strangers (read: illegal aliens), and the rich using their money to 'buy' justice.
Time to go all Old Testament on their asses.
Whether or not some of the posters here believe in a higher power, a lot of people do, and Obama's their president, too. He needs to talk to them in a way they'll understand.
Fair enough, but I object to the way he's doing it. He's not saying, "In the Bible it says..." He's saying, "I believe in God's command."
God had a lot of angry, gory, smiting commands in the first half of the book and as they're all from the big guy, himself, maybe those should be obeyed too, they're commands.
far left loon >.<
i've read it, several times, it is a book about morals, it's a book about what we call spiritual themes, it's not a science book, it's not a rule book.
the old testament is vicious, the new is much better, incorporates a lot of zen.
"I come not to bring peace, but to bring a sword" (Matthew 10:34)
"I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." (Matthew 5:18)
are few and far between in the NT
That's because there were plenty in the OT and as Jesus specifically says, OT law is not to be overturned, ever.
i may as well have a divinity degree, even though i don't believe a bit of it, i have had the education.
jesus said that the old testament had "been fulfilled", which indicates that that deal was done, finito, complete. the other thing is that at the last supper he said that the chalice was "the blood of the new and everlasting covenant" which would indicate that the new covenant superseded the old. i could quote this stuff by the time i got out of grade school, then at about age 12, i came to my senses, not that i ever believed it, i argued about it in the 1st grade.
so, no, the OT is no longer operative for a christian.
Don't mean to preach here ( what you or I believe is irrelevant ) but according to the Bible the coming of Christ did away with much of the old law , it's called the New testament for a reason .These cherry picking Christians on the Reich are not Christians , they may think they are but they are not , the Bible talks at length about these kinds of people , they claim to be Christians but their works say otherwise , they're fooling themselves , playing God , judging people , hypocrites , greedy , selfish , hateful , according to the Bible when they go to face God ( judgement day ) many who call themselves Christians are going to be in for a very rude awakening , God will say out of my sight , I never knew you . End of sermon , carry on .
"The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all."
you got that reich..........
according to the Bible the coming of Christ did away with much of the old law
Yes, I am aware of that Kreskin. Yet, how often do you hear people say, "an eye for an eye." and other (gory) popular favourites? Some people see that kind of thing as God's command also.
I'd prefer the president separate religion and politics 100%, like your founding fathers meant and was written in the Constitution.
far left loon >.<
Agree Edwin . Human nature . Here's a challenge , name one thing that man has not F'd up or will not find a way to F up ? Where there is power and money involved bad people are going to take advantage and they will inevitably F it up .Here's where I'm at , my beliefs are my own , my spirituality , my relationship with a higher power or with my God ( if I have one ) is private and no one else's business and I absolutely don't need any organization or middle man . To each their own as long as they don't hurt anyone and do not try to impose their beliefs or ideology on me .
"The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all."
was good thing. It codified that you weren't allowed to take more than an eye, or a hand or another life. It put a limit on vengeance.
This country has been absolutely schizophrenic about religion right from very start. While the Mass. Commonwealth was busy showing Quakers, Catholics, Jews and Anabaptists to the borders, William Penn (PA) and Roger Williams (RI) let anybody set up housekeeping. Meanwhile you had the charter companies advertising free-market capitalism, "Come to America and get rich!" This kind of craziness is in our national dna.
According to the bible, Jesus said the old law was specifically not to be done away with. That's the bible for you.
until "all had been fulfilled" which was the crucifixion, if you are into that sort of thing; and then paul came along and hijacked it all.
see derekthered's post . The old law ( obviously ) does not mean the ten commandments . I'm going to quit as of now . LOL . This just isn't a good idea .
"The poor have sometimes objected to being governed badly; the rich have always objected to being governed at all."
which bible?
http://www.allbibles.com/bibleversions.asp
seems that the good book has been massaged more than deion sanders
"I never told my own religion, nor scrutinized that of another." Thomas Jefferson, letter to Mrs. M. Harrison Smith,1816.
"And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together." James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston,1822.
""Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's." Matthew 22:21
Corruption favors the wealthy.
when i grew up and went to school there were certain teachers................
look up the "blue army of the lady of fatima" nevermind,
Catholic Anti-Communism
http://www.catholicity.com/commentary/allitt/...
. . . and raise you some Liberation Theology.
In particular, Archbishop of San Salvador, Óscar Romero who was assassinated by a Salvadoran Death Squad in 1980 while saying mass.
On why some Catholics were persecuted and others were not:
Corruption favors the wealthy.
"holy" mother church cracked down on the liberation theology.
here is a recent book review
http://www.jadaliyya.com/pages/index/4226/pro...
Walter Brueggemann, The Practice of Prophetic Imagination: Preaching an Emancipatory Word. Minneapolis: Fortress Press, 2012.
and, yup, i have written about romero before, shot to death right at the altar, by deaths squads schooled at the school of the americas.
I have a fundamental problem with the whole "tradition" of this "Pray Breakfast". You know, the whole Separation of Church and State thing. That being said, Obama, like previous presidents, knows that he'll be attacked by the right if he passes on this "tradition". So what does he do? He uses it his advantage to not only push his policies, but to severely b**ch slap Mr. Mitt "I'm not concerned about poor people" Romney. Politically, it was brilliant!
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven
or.
Whatsoever you do for the least of my brothers that you do unto me.
or
Not everyone who says, "Lord, lord" shall enter into heaven, but those who do the will of the father shall enter.
or....any number of biblical verses that the Republicans are able to block out at will.
The new testament is the part of the bible where sinners are thrown in hell, that loving place where you burn in fire for eternity even if your only crime is not believing in god. ... fuck god, he's a twat ...
*sigh, would the dominionists win, people might wake up ... ah but too late ...
This is way out of CONTEXT, This makes me so mad using my Gods word for the Progressive agenda to trap people in false guilt. SMH
Jesus is Lord. :-)
Who appointed you judge? How is the guilt false? Why is it OK to twist biblical word for the regressive agenda of the neocons, teatards, Talibaptists, evangelicals and the republic party? You people do that all the time. Then when the president says something to you about it, you all start crying about it and bearing false witness against the man, throwing hate his way.
You know what? You haven't a clue what your Christ was about.
me-oww!
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