Gingrich Argues God Must Exist Because People Aren't Rhinos
At a campaign event in Des Moines, Iowa Thursday, Republican presidential candidate Newt Gingrich answered a question from a woman who was concerned that he supported the idea of religion imposing values on Americans.
"I'm very concerned that a branch of Christianity has gotten some of its tenets into our laws like stem cell research, linking foreign aid to reproductive issues and so forth," she told the former House Speaker. "If you were president, would you work hard to make Christian social issues the law of the land?"
"I don't know that the two you just cited are Christian social issues," Gingrich replied. "I think Orthodox Jews probably have as profound a belief as Christians do on both those issues."
"I don't regard that as imposing a particular branch of Christianity. That's an argument about what values do you have whatever your religion happens to be. My argument about religion is different. We said in our founding document, we are endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights. Now should we teach children that or not? Should they learn what the founding fathers meant or not?"
He continued: "The idea that taking school prayer out in 1963 made the country better, I don't see any evidence that children who don't spend a moment recognizing that they're subservient to God let's you approach God in anyway you want to. There is an enormous difference between a culture which believes that it is purely secular and a culture that believes that it is somehow empowered by our creator. And I always tell my friends who don't believe in this stuff, "Fine, how do you think we came to -- we're randomly gathered protoplasm? We could have been rhinoceroses but we got lucky this week?'"
"Now, that is if you assume it is lucky to be human rather than rhinoceros. I don't want -- knowing the way the news media works, I do not want 'Gingrich announces anti-rhinoceros hostility' to come out of this meeting."
EDITOR'S NOTE: Rhinoceros, Newt, really? Do you think a dude who's cheated on his wives as many times as you should open himself up to a series of "horny" jokes?
And Gingrich is said to be the most intelligent of the GOP candidates.
He certainly is the only one who practised serial polygamy
Alfie46
Are you saying he's been married to a few flakes? ;)
I was about to note the same thing, Alfie. The rap on Gingrich in certain media circles is supposed to be that he's an idea man and a deep, serious thinker. He is nothing of the kind and the mish-mash of non sequiturs in this clip is a prime example. Years ago I made the mistake of giving him some small credit because he strayed off the wingnut reservation and voiced some tepid doubts about ID as a scientific theory. His "rhino" comments here show that he's back to pandering to the religious nutters in his party.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! I've been saying forever that,if this guy is as brilliant as advertised, why do we see so little evidence of it? He comes out with one incredibly goofy statement after another.
It's people who seem to think a multiplicity of degrees is the same thing as being brilliant... he's shown their view to be laughable.
In the marketplace of ideas, too many people shop in the bargain basement.
-- Thunder BlueRose
Why, yes, I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU
http://saxman.bravepages.com
He was just feeling his oats.
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
Cheerio, my friend!
In the marketplace of ideas, too many people shop in the bargain basement.
-- Thunder BlueRose
Why, yes, I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU
http://saxman.bravepages.com
These guys and Crazy Eyes are running for POTUS, not Pontiff. WTF???? They should all STFU.
far left loon >.<
Actually Gingrich thinks god must exist because he hasn't yet been tarred and feathered. What other explanation could there possibly be, right Lizard Man?
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
Of course Newt believes in a Creator - he got to watch them put his wife together. ;)
God gave us dominion over this creature that we kill for its' horn....
that has been evolving for 50 million years....
Time will tell if we can survive ourselves....and it won't be long to find out.
If the Founding Fathers had meant to say "endowed by God" they would have said it.
They said, "endowed by Our Creator" without specifying who or what "Our Creator" is.
It is outrageously presumptuous for one "Christian" after another to MISQUOTE The Founding Fathers.
When will government of the people, by the politicians, for the corporations perish from this Earth?
Not soon enough!
Absolutely right. There is a reason they didn't use the word God. Religious or not, everyone has important reasons to keep religion out of government and out of politics, and the founders knew how important this is way back then too. It is only recently that people are starting to forget.
Sign the Whitehouse.gov petition to remove the phrase "Under God"
"Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob"
-= Franklin Delano Roosevelt =-
Okay, first - my street cred here: Newt Gingrich is an idiot. Everything he said in that little rant is bonkers. And, I'm an outspoken atheist, vehemently pro-separation of church and state, and literally fear the encroach of religion upon our government.
Okay? Everyone know where I'm coming from? People who know my writings here know, right? Right. Okay then . . . .
MountainMan23:
ApeMan:
Let's take a look at our founding document, shall we? Are ya ready? Brace yourselves . . . .
Let's not go kidding ourselves about the Founding Fathers. They were not monolithic on anything. They were in such disagreement on just about every issue that it was not uncommon for stick fights to break out on the floor of the Continental Congress. And they were certainly not monolithic on the separation of church and state. There were MANY antidisestablishmentarians among the founders.
Heard of Patrick Henry? Give me liberty or give me death? Yeah, he wanted to establish Christianity as the official religion of Virginia to create a system of Christian public schools. And originally, the First Amendment was only designed to limit the federal government so that it could not impose a federal religion on the sovereign states, which did reserve the power to establish their own religions.
The Declaration does, in fact, use the word "God." Now, it actually says "Nature's God." That's a Jeffersonian concept, and certainly not a Christian one. Jefferson was not a Christian. But many of the founders were, and were pro-Christian establishment.
The Declaration also uses the term "Divine Providence." That's not explicitly Christian either, but it sure isn't secular.
So, did the founders mean god when they said "Creator?" It depends on the founder, and for many of them, the answer would be an unequivocal yes.
What does all this mean vis-a-vis prayer in school, separation of church and state, etc? Not much. Our Constitution has evolved over the centuries, and with the Fourteenth Amendment, we have Incorporated fundamental rights onto the states. We now recognize that the immunity from establishment is one such fundamental right.
But if we're going to win the war of ideas here, let's be historically accurate. It does our side no favors not to recognize our actual history, which is a bloody mess riddled with state establishment, slavery and aristocracy. The iconic founders we know and love (Jefferson, Madison, Franklin, Adams) were for the separation of church and state, but had a lot of opposition from other founders in their time. They carried the day in Virginia against the likes of Patrick Henry, and got the First Amendment into the Constitution. But never forget how limited that amendment originally was.
This is a fight that has been going on since our country's inception. It will require eternal vigilance. Which will require genuine knowledge of our history to combat today's antidisestablishmentarians effectively.
As for Newt Gingrich, fuck him. He has the intelligence of a rhinoceros. (Please, no jokes about how that insults rhinos.)
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
Yes, many of the Founders did believe in the biblical God, which makes it even more impressive that they left Him out of the Constitution. There was a reason for that. Jefferson explained it pretty well, which is probably why Jefferson is becoming persona non-grata to the right over the last few years.
Rhinoceroses and random protoplasm are two topics that Newt Gingrich should carefully avoid.
More to Newt's point, rhinos don't hunt giraffes, either.
I have far more respect for rhinos that I do for New Gingrich.
Maybe he mean RINOs.
And he's considered the intellectual of the Republican Party, folks. Think about that for a minute.
If you have selfish, ignorant citizens, you're gonna get selfish, ignorant leaders.
George Carlin
But we ARE "rhinos." We are a unique biological specimen that takes our characteristics as the norm because that's what we're used to. We could have just as easily have three legs, or three eyes, or wings, and we'd then consider that the norm, as well.
I've seen the argument before that if evolution was real, there'd be "weird" hybrid animals. I say that there are "weird" hybrid animals, we're just used to seeing them everyday, making them the norm for us. "Fish" that breathe oxygen? Mammals that lay eggs? That's evolution, baby.
Is there really anybody who believes there are no "weird" hybrid animals? Have they never seen the platypus - a duck-billed monstrosity of a mammal that (as you say) lays eggs and has poison fangs in its back feet?
Have any of these people ever actually seen an animal that wasn't a cow, a dog, or a horse? I mean seriously, have they never heard of zoos?
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
otherwise, why would they keep mutilating them?
Every time an alien landing party sets out in the rural midwest, they come across cows and freak the 'eff out, blasting them with space-disrupters.+
I forget who it was, maybe even Newt Gingrich, a few months ago, who said that if evolution was real, why aren't there horses with wings, or stuff like that.
Because if there were, we'd think that was "normal."
If there was a god would she allow republiscums to exist?
Why wouldn't she? Please keep in mind that gods are not humans - they have little scruples when it comes to us. (About as much as most of us have for cows, pigs, or horses.) The christian god invented us because he was bored, remember. Why wouldn't a creator mix it up with as much weirdness as possible? Not as nice, but like the coach said, "If nothing else, they'll sure be fun to watch!"
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
testing our faith. And our patience.
GOP talking points: all sound and fury signifying nothing.
This was supposed to be a response to the comment above. *eek*
There's always free cheddar in the mousetrap, baby. - Tom Waits
by divorcing multiple times?
CTHULHU 2012 "Why vote for a lesser evil?"
I think "argues" is rather generous.
"Blathers" would be more suited.
Makes me wonder if the real rhinos in the Bronx Zoo are saying "There must be a God. Otherwise I might be Newt Gingrich."
The disciples of Reagan's "government is not the solution to your problem, government IS the problem" meme are nonetheless big fans of government when they want it to do one thing:
Lead elementary school kids in prayer.
Teachers, we are told by these people, are overpaid union members who need to be knocked down a notch or two, unless of course they want to do one thing:
Lead school kids in prayer.
And let's remember that Newt (ironically, an academic on occasion) is one of those types who is constantly decrying the power of academia - basically, schools - to improperly shape the beliefs of impressionable young people. Unless of course those schools are doing one thing:
Leading the kids in prayer.
To hear these folks tell it, a teacher isn't even qualified to show someone how to open a can of beans, but we're supposed to believe they can effectively bring kids to Jesus?
Really?
Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny & gawd don't exist. Never did, never will. Grow up.
Humpty Dumpty was pushed.
but God gave us the power of evolution to evolve that way....
Listening to anything Newt say's, is in that direction.
In other words . . . .
I personally cannot imagine a universe not governed by a god, and by virtue of my failure of imagination and capacity for abstract thought, I claim both certainty on the matter and the right to impose it on you. Not that you have to be a Christian (you can go to hell for all I care), but not believing in god at all? Sorry, that's not an option. And don't give me that evolution crap. I haven't studied it or anything, but I know I ain't no rhinoceros.
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
I love how this zealot asks a guy who cheated on 2 wives and has been married 3 times if he will work hard to make "Christian social values" the law of the land.
OK.
This is something I have pondered at times. What if I had been born a dog, or an elephant or a spider? Ok, maybe not a rhino...but still....How are rocks formed and how do they get from wherever they started to where I am? What if I was the rock that I was mindlessly kicking down the street as I walked?
Is there reincarnation? Could I come back as a rock? Or a rhino?
I think there's a certain school of thought in Christianity or whatever the hell Newt believes in that all life, but particularly human life, was very deliberately created. And we may evolve...but that In the Beginning there wsa...Something.
I don't know. I kind of like the fact that Newt, of all the God-forsaken people out there, is capable of this type of abstract thought. And his foibles make him human - it's his policies and other shit - the fact that he truly believes that he is entitlted to live his life as he sees fit, but would restrict that freedom for others that makes him a truly POS human being, much like the other Republicans.
But Newt, has given me hope today, that even Republicans can evolve, think and grown. Not fast enough for me or to give any hope to the planet, but there is hope for him. Maybe. He's probably too much of an asshole to really give it a shot.
And I hate you all today for making me speak up for Newt Gingrich whom I ordinarily despise.
Again!! Newt take your home wrecking Whoooa & go home
You ordinarily oppose Gingrich, but since he believes in god because he does not understand evolution and cannot comprehend the notion of a universe not created by a conscious mind, you appreciate his capacity for abstract thought and growth?
His statements are both common and stupid. Republicans make similar statements all the time. Why in the world would you be compelled to bolster them?
That's not what he was contemplating. And if you want to understand the subjective mind of a dog or an elephant (or ant or a spider), pick up some philosophy and science books. You can expand your understanding. Hell, you can even read the arguments about the nature of mind and why it may not be limited to animals like us. Could consciousness be in rocks? In economies? In the universe itself? There are deep thoughts to be appreciated here. They were not running through Newt-wit's big dumb head.
And once you start reading all the myriad philosophical answers, and understand how we can rely on what we think we know, you'll be asking a different question: Is there good evidence to believe in reincarnation as a rock or a rhino?
Ya think? Most people believe that the universe was deliberately created by a mind. It's part and parcel of monotheism.
Or maybe there wasn't. Physicists are discovering that "nothingness" is inherently unstable. Something is actually likely to result from nothing. Try wrapping your head around that one for abstract thought. :)
The truly honest answer to questions like "How did it all begin?" and "What is consciousness?" is we don't know yet. Starting from that point will lead you toward the truth as best as it can be humanly ascertained.
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
Uh, Deborah, you're talking about the transmigration of souls... a related concept, but not quite the same thing.
In the marketplace of ideas, too many people shop in the bargain basement.
-- Thunder BlueRose
Why, yes, I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU
http://saxman.bravepages.com
Apparently, all this "God" nonsense isn't worth much - consider that god-botherers like Mark Sanford, David Vitter, George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, even Newt Gingrich himself have ALL sinned (and rather egregiously so).
Plenty of 'forgiveness' when it's THEIR arses, but only damnation when it's someone else's. God gets his knickers in a twist over gays and liberals and secularists and he'll throw tornadoes, hurricanes, earthquakes, droughts, and all sorts of problems at us. In that respect, belief in God is no different than belief in a more primitive pantheon of naturalistic gods - it's all superstitious claptrap.
Christianity, like most monotheistic religions, requires its adherents to believe there are only two "sides" to every issue: the "Good" and the "Evil". Anything the believers see as their side is, of course, caused by their "god"; anything they don't want is, by contrast, caused by the "devil". It's the only way they can "reason" the existence of homosexuality, murder, rape, greed, torture, slavery, et al: these things are all caused by the evil balancing force, to "test" their faith, and were not caused by their "god", because "he" is a benevolent and just god, who would never cause "his" creations to suffer.
And if these believers called their "god" by another name, maybe Sparkles the Unicorn, they would be led straight to the looney-bin and placed in a padded cell. Which is why "religion" is such a farce, when you get right down to it. Its sole purpose is to give power over humans to a smaller number of humans.
"Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" - Red Green
Freedom Ain't Free - Pay Your Share
has considered the possibility that rhinoceroses are, at this very moment, discussing politics and saying to one another, "Thank God we were born Rhinos, imagine how awful life would be if we had been born Human. Or worse, Republican."
GOP talking points: all sound and fury signifying nothing.
Or...
Some of us got lucky this week. The rest of us are rhinos. The difference is that if we were rhino's, we wouldn't be talking about whether we were humans or rhinos or the nature of God.
It's basically a variation on the weak anthropic principle. The fact that intelligent life exists isn't that amazing when you consider that, in other universes where it doesn't, nobody's around to notice or think about it.
Plural: Rhinoceri
yeah, but mr greengrinch just loves the sound of his own voice saying 'rhinoceroses'.
littlebadwolf
Leave us out this Gnewt. Judaism doesn't have the same problem with abortion and stem research Evangelicals and other Christian sects do. We believe in free will -- and science...
"Fox News is a cancer on our Nation" -- Me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FArZxLj6DLk
Newt might not be a Rhino...but he sure can be horny !
Riverside
Dunno... is that the same thing as being a RINO?
In the marketplace of ideas, too many people shop in the bargain basement.
-- Thunder BlueRose
Why, yes, I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU
http://saxman.bravepages.com
they go together like flies and shit....
The Newtster makes about as much sense as saying that the fact that a bicycle does not wear shoes proves there's a God....
In the marketplace of ideas, too many people shop in the bargain basement.
-- Thunder BlueRose
Why, yes, I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU
http://saxman.bravepages.com
Newt doesn't buy this hokem. He's just slinging it for his base. Did he send his kids go to Christian schools, where they taught that evolution was bologna? I doubt it.
She's testing our faith. And our patience
She's testing our sense of humor.
Vote GOP and move forward to the 18th Century.
If its not rhinos, it's pigs and giraffes:
He's got animals on the brain. Callista better make sure he's not cheating on her with the family dog.
Happy International Blasphemy Day, everyone!
That first "its" should have been an "it's".
That Yogi was "smarter than the average bear" was an evolutionary advantage in Jellystone Park. Can the same be said of Newty in relation to his fellow Georgians?
Newtie got divorced a couple of times then joined the Roman Catholic Church. So much for adultery. Remember, this is an organization that moves pedophile priests around from parish to parish then hides behind the Vatican's diplomatic status to keep us from seeing if the chicanery goes all the way to Castel Gandalfo. I should think that Newtie puts his shekels in the plate every Sunday just like all the other makerel snappers, helping the Vatican with cover-ups and pre-judgment settlements (pay offs). Newtie makes a perfect Catholic: he believes in myth and fantasy, dogma and dissembling. You can trust Newtie...to be Newtie. Barf!
"Respect for the rights of others is peace." --Benito Juarez
parish church where four generations of my family have now gone. The guy was a divorced Russian Orthodox whose wife had left him. The priest told her for $5000 the Vatican could have his marriage annulled and they would be good to go! No better than biblical Pharisees and money-changers. Sister went for the civil ceremony.
Janek
. . . . .
Janek
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