August 30, 2009 10:00 AM
George Will wants truth commission on torture
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Conservative columnist George Will has joined many who are calling for a commission to investigate the use of enhanced interrogation techiniques. "We ought to have a commission. Fred Hiatt in The Washington Post suggests this morning, Sandra Day O'Connor and David Souter, bring them down, set it up and answer some factual questions," said Will.
We should have a special prosecutor and prosecutions.
statusquObama, change you can only pretend in
Anything less than a criminal investigation with prosecutions is a waste of time. Truth commissions are simply being put forward by conservative voices to avoid prosecution.
Obama better not get weak on this, really, Holder. Holder better stand his ground and do it no matter what the president wants. If there is evidence of torture, it is a crime. Truth commissions would be an insult to the American people.
...........he could only indict Libby, not Rove or Cheney, so Spec. Prosecutors are just another 'bait and switch.'
Liz Cheney's voice is always heard when everyboby talks. It seems to me that her microphone is given priority. This is not the first time I notice that right wing talking heads are always heard more clearily than others during a crosstalk.
every blonde bimb wingnut hack has a shrill voice
man...she really is daddy's little girl
She uses a weirding module.
Liz Cheney is nothing more than a unqualified lying rotten bitch whoring for her mass murdering father. Whenever additional information of her sick dad's worldwide criminal activities are exposed, this shank crawls out of the woodwork like a Manson sex slave to defend this diseased bastard. Fucking shame on Stephanopoulos for putting this discredited jaded slut on that panel to lie for her father.
And we complain about Libyan terrorists getting off.
Truth commissions are a dandy start, but they should NOT be asking the immoral question, "Does torture work?" If we are civilized, we should be beyond that. The questions must be, "Who tortured? Who gave the orders? What punishment must they receive?" Anything less and we are as guilty for letting our leaders get away with it as they are guilty for doing it.
Candideinnc
Truth commissions are a waste of time, criminal investigations and prosecutions would still have to happen. Why not go straight to the criminal investigation.
the dick might find that offensive.
me-oww!
Does this idiot have any idea what he's saying? A 'truth commission' was set up in South Africa after the Apartheid system collapsed as a means of investigating and uncovering what everyone acknowledged was a total breakdown in human rights, natural justice and the rule of law. The 'truth commission' was a compromise - it was way to expose the crimes of the white nationalist government, without criminal prosecution. The 'truth commission' gave Nelson Mandela's jailers and the murderers and torturers of Steve Biko and thousands of other victims a free pass.
THERE ALREADY IS A "TRUTH COMMISSION" IN THE US. (pardon the all-caps)
It's called the JUSTICE DEPARTMENT - more specifically, the Grand Jury system, administered by the DOJ.
Our last commissions conclusion? "911 was caused by a failure of imagination in the intelligence community"
No accountability, just a bunch of overpaid spooks without the right tools and a lack of imagination.
How much money will this commission cost us?
What is the goal? Prosecutions? Probably off the table?
Will the sell the American people a book about their redacted findings after it is all done?
Maybe say that no one could have imagined that torturing someone was wrong?
I"m not sure how many times I have mentioned this here but my Dad was an ex-pow in North Korea and has forgotten more torture than the immoral and total ass-wipe cheney dreams up on his worst wet dream!Goodfreakin grief this traitor is a war criminal! AAAARRRRGGGGGGG!!!!!This asshole cheney is not a Patriot is is a criminal!
The love you take is equal to the love you make. John Lennon Paul Mc Cartney
what fucking gdcsing mofo asswipes for even asking. I'd like to tell you what I REALLY think, but I believe the entire internet, if not, at least my part of the system, would melt.
me-oww!
They are going there. Fuck ethics, fuck morality, fuck humanity, fuck legal, use anything if it "works." And, thank you very much, we'll define "works".
Aren't these the same folks who rant against situational ethics?
In order for any debate to follow, both sides must stipulate to the fact that, explicit denials from the Bush administration notwithstanding, America DID torture.
Please, not Sandra Day O'Connor. She will be biased. Remember when the presidential election was decided by the Supreme Court, she said the reason she voted for Georgie was because "I have been friends with the elder Bushes for years, and did not want to see them disappointed" Not James Baker, either.
...just start the trials now...
the trials will take a couple of years and so will the "Truth comission" investigation.
Then we can see how it all comes together.
Cheney and Bush will probly be found guilty and the judge can then consider the truth comissions findings ...and sentence them accordingly...sound like a plan?
audit-prosecute-incarcerate
This is a charade. These war criminals need to go before an international court as they have committed crimes against humanity. And clearly, the US does not have any intention of doing anything about this, except run out the SOL on any possible charges, and talk it to death. Isn't there any honest government with some courage anywhere? Please? At least get it on paper, and in the public record. Not everyone in this country deserves the hate and disdain of the rest of the world. Help us!
I don't know who I find more offensive, the war criminals or those who would whitewash war crimes. Holder is on the right track with the special prosecutor, George Will is not sincere with this bogus "truth commission".
Politics is for the present, but an equation is for eternity. Albert Einstein
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LOL...
... DID TORTURE WORK?
Let's talk about justifying why doing something "ILLEGAL" is acceptable.
WHAT'S ANARCHY?
.
Starve the WAR Beast...
... Feed Americans.
.
So,
When we're done jailing those who "strayed" from their "ORDERS"...
... Can we then discuss the "ORDERS"?
I DIDN'T KNOW I COULD "ORDER" THE LAW TO BE VIOLATED.
.
Starve the WAR Beast...
... Feed Americans.
he's going to offend Dick Cheney and we can't be having that!!
I thought the courts were all about getting to the truth.
...they're not.
Courts court the rich, so, nothing about getting The Truth. No, no,no, Justice in the USofBLOODYISRAEL is only for the rich, hello???? Wake up, the Justice system was written by the rich, and for the rich, and creatures like Cheney, Bushes, Kissenger, these rich, known, war criminals are untouchable.
who wants to meet people like George Will and Sam Donaldson just to tell them "dude, we know it's a wig. Just take it off. It looks more ridiculous than if you were bald."
To me, a toupe' is a sign of a bad liar. So is a combover.
about the combover as I get older and thinner on top.
i have since i turned 21
i dont do like my dad with the combover bit...its silly
but i am thinking about doing the head shave deal
It's all that's left us because of all that's left us.
Good one, seevee!
I was 21. I was lucky in that I had an unusally low hairline to start out with so at 40, I still have lots...for now. But for every hair that I lose from my head, I gain two on my back and shoulders. Mmmm. Sexy.
The Dick mite be offended!
The Dick mite get mad!
The Dick mite break into your home late at night and wreck up the joint!
are no fun, let me tell you.
THAT is how you set up a power negotiation: from a position of strength.
If there was no investigation, do you think "serious" journalists would be calling for a truth commission?
If Obama had proposed a truth commission, George Will would be proposing Congressional Medals of Honor all around.
if torture works, are there other methods the United States of America would use? Would we use human shields? Would we decapitate wives and children of detainees to solicit information? Would we flame-throw angry civilian mobs? There are a lot of things that "work" that are out of bounds. We're stuck abiding to those pesky laws. Whether or not torture works is changing the lede--don't be fooled.
fact: torture is illegal
fact: waterboarding is torture...we prosecuted the japanese for using it
fact: we waterboarded and the cheney states that he was aware of it being used
fact: it has now come out that other methods of torture were used multiple times
fact: doesnt matter what intel was gleaned...the methods were illegal under us and international law
fact: everyone who was a part of the torture program should go directly to prison
why do we need a commission to restate the above?
...find out if starting an illegal and undeclared war in Iraq/Afghanistan ...based on lies and propaganda, ...and killing hundreds of thousands ...is "worth it"
audit-prosecute-incarcerate
it is a good question on how the congress has, since korea, side stepped its responisibility to declare war
but afghanistan was legal...and was winnable until bush started iraq
now afghanistan is a shit storm
...no I don't.
(probably) because I dont think 911 was planned and executed by redneck muslims who live in caves.
I never saw any evidence (that I believed) that Bin Laden and Khalid Sheik Mohommed were responsible. (and the FBI agrees with me)
audit-prosecute-incarcerate
The invasion of Afghanistan was not legal. Afghanistan is a sovereign nation and did not attack anyone let alone the US. They would have been happy to sell us Bin Laden for the right price, but BushCo/Cheney saw an opportunity to take by force what they really wanted - the Trans-Afghanistan Pipeline. Plans to invade Afghanistan were on the books long before 9/11. The Taliban
Bin Laden and 15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudi nationals. If there was any one place to go after 9/11 it was Saudi Arabia.
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Q U E S T I O N:
If a Leader can "ORDER" laws to be violated...
... What then differentiates them from a Dictator or a King?
.
Starve the WAR Beast...
... Feed Americans.
usually end up paying for their crimes.
+
... over and over - especially when they've lost. Whether or not torture should be used by civilized nations was discussed and decided when the Geneva Conventions were negotiated and ratified and again with the Conventions on Torture. Conservatives lost - overwhelmingly. Yet they still want to argue the point and pretend it's a new discussion.
A lot like "creationism" over seventy five years after the Scopes trial.
Corruption favors the wealthy.
I wouldn't be shocked to see a movement to deny Obama's legitimacy based on Dred Scott precedent.
and your ilk, debate this point:
Cutting off people's hands is an unquestionably effective method of stopping them from stealing again.
That said, why don't we use this very effective method to achieve the end?
they wouldn't like to?
Classic misdirection. We don't need criminal investigations, we need a Truth Commission! Next thing you'll hear is Cheney calling for one.
The sad truth is that without criminal investigation AND prosecution to the full extent of the law, we condone these activities.
This is hard to believe. Repubs do not question repubs when they break the law.
It's not a real question. It's meant to deflect criminal investigation.
but it helps that her voice is incredibly grating. Also, she is a peerless master at avoiding questions, talking over people and cutting them off to make sure that noone else gets to make their point.
On a separate note, I think it is galling that the daughter of the man who is at the heart of this crime scene is repeatedly invited to comment on it as though she is an objective analyst.
draw the line Mr. Dick?
Does it just keep getting pushed forward in relation to your own ever increasing paranoia?
They just loot the public till and say . . "Yeah we conclude after our 5 month study in our investigation that they used enhanced torture techniques."
The media's supposed to be doing this stuff. Granted there are no real reporters anymore willing to put their ass and neck on the line to break the big story.
Did FDR know the Jpas were coming?
Who Killed JFK?
Why has America lost its Death Panel Edge?
Were facists unhappy liberals took over their movement?
It's ratings will be higher than Anna Nichole's inquest and might threaten MJ's funeral.
"The deal has to be negotiated in the real world, not on some idealized Aristotelian plane. We understand that. A 100-percent deal may be impossible."
Famous "Reality Based" Commentator
Why don't we get ordinary citizens on a commission. Hell, I'm retired, I'll volunteer and I know a few other vets that will, too.
to destroy our country. Nothing less then full scale prosecutions should be acceptable to ANY American!
George Will: We don't need prosecution at Nuremberg. We need a Truth Commission. Whether the holocaust was immoral or how immoral surely depends on whether or not it worked?
The next time any of the clowns on this panel raises a question of values, they ought to be made to watch their sorry ass silence or assent in this flabbergasting and disgusting discussion.
"The deal has to be negotiated in the real world, not on some idealized Aristotelian plane. We understand that. A 100-percent deal may be impossible."
Famous "Reality Based" Commentator
the more amazed I am that this fool has any credibility.
Immorality of an act is directly determined by the effectiveness of
the act.
He just declared abotion moral as a means of protection against unwanted birth. He just declared Death Panels as a moral means of cost cutting for Medicare. He just declared sterilzation and extermination a moral means of reducing future birth defects.
"The deal has to be negotiated in the real world, not on some idealized Aristotelian plane. We understand that. A 100-percent deal may be impossible."
Famous "Reality Based" Commentator
Is George Will on our side now? Or is this just a rare outburst of sense while he is changing his meds?
NOBODY GOES TO FEDERAL PRISON. No trials, no indictments, no LAYING OF RESPONSIBILITY... just an empty investigation.
Un-Constitutional!
someone put a topical serum under his rug. I like loons and shall not refer too it that fashion.
Will knows that when there is a commission, there usually aren't any prosecutions.He aint foolin' anybody.
Perhaps Will is considering that the Holder investigation on the narrow endeavor of the torture issue could just expand? Then follow up stream to where they were pissing in the water.
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